Jump to content
Double Fine Action Forums


DFA Backers
  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

About Drake1009

  • Rank
    Action Newbie
  1. I'm along with the whole "coincidence" bit. If for no other reason than it being the ship offering the cereal, while what you're alluding to is done to spite said ship. Sure there could be some sort of conspiracy, but I still opt for "not connected"
  2. You completed them so quickly because you already know the solutions! It would be interesting to see how long it would take you to finish monkey 2 with no walkthough as you haven't played it before. I would guess 10h + and defo not in one sitting. I think I've already spent 10+ hours on MI2 without getting all that far. I'm not really good at adventure games. And yes I completed it so quickly because I know the solutions, and most of the intervening dialogue by heart. What I was getting at was that unlike those games, Act 1 felt rather short, mainly because I never got stuck anywhere. There are less things to interact with and get stumped for a solution to. But I'm guessing going with the direct path, not skipping dialogue, Broken Age will take a bit to complete. Day of the Tentacle takes a bit longer, but I don't know whether the plans for Act 2 are to be same sized or bigger or smaller or whatnot. At any rate, I still rather like it for the humour, the artstyle and the voice acting. And no I'm not about to go back to the Island of Simians 2 just yet. Still need to get further in Night of the Rabbit (sadly not a day of the tentacle followup), which while it has rather nice graphics, also sadly is a rather good example of why voice acting and unskippable or slow to skip repeated dialogue can be grating on some people's nerves when stumped for what to do next.
  3. Must say I haven't seen that blueprint bit before, and I've played most of the telltale games too. But I've always wondered why large inventory items aren't just lying around and you just "remember" that you can go grab it and get it (maybe with a quick note the first few times akin to "I'll use the Chron-o-john"). It'd avoid you having to figure out how to explain someone carrying a ladder inside their jacket or similar. Some games lend themselves better to the unbelieveable inventory management system than others ("You hold onto this", "I'd better, I don't know where you'd put it", "That's none of your business Sam") It'll also give you a good way to leave items out of inventory once they are no longer relevant. You could've travelled somewhere or someone could've removed it. I could easily imagine a protagonist like Simon The Sorcerer going back for an item he didn't feel like lugging around until he knew where he wanted it to go, only to find a troll or something had gone and taken it, then ensuing argument and subsequent puzzle to "regain" your inventory item you were about to use. (Please disregard the fact that Simon is a Sorcerer and keeps things in his hat and is thus not constrained by not being able to carry along that ladder).
  4. Yes it's rather easy (evident by the fact I've completed Vella's story without trouble) and the interface is simplified compared to the adventures of old. But that said, I played Full Throttle loaded onto my Wii about half a year ago. Completed it in 2 hours (but it did skip the travel and derby events because of lack of support in scummvm). And in my 1 hour commute from work home I played around halfway through Day of the Tentacle on my phone. So yeah, adventure games have been short before, but there's usually been more stuff to confound players and stump them for a long time. I haven't completed Monkey island 2, but I seem to recall the commentary for it mentioning something about wanting the game to be at least x hours, by way of making sure you had to spend a long time travelling from place to place. Which is something which rather bothered me about adventure games. Time spent walking back and forth and back again, listening to the same comments when trying various ideas, that was something this game didn't make aggravating for me. As for death...that wasn't really possible in Day of the Tentacle, or Sam & Max. Or Full throttle (sure you could get knocked off your bike), or The Dig. I think it was possible to die in Monkey Island 1 if you didn't solve the rather simple puzzle under the world. So far I've been happy with Broken Age. I can understand why some are disappointed though, and for reason. Short, yes sure. Easy, maybe a bit too. Simplified UI? Definitely, though that just removes some of the aggravation of not getting the puzzle because you pressed Open instead of Push. Yes it felt like a game made for tablet. But at least for me, the aim of old adventure games for me was always the dialogue, the world, the comments when examining things. The puzzles were sometimes satisfying, but at the same time it could take away enjoyment of a game when you couldn't solve a puzzle because you missed a few pixels worth of item, or you hadn't spent hours clicking each inventory item on every other item in the game, walking back and forth. Classic adventure game? No. The good things of the classic genre distilled and sadly a bit simplified? Yes. More interactable items would've been nice. Their existence would've increased puzzle difficulty, and given more items to have quirky comments about.
  5. You are indeed right. It is apparently a case of me being not so much slow, rather too fast. Man this is just like driving. I just did a test again. And just as you said, there's more to the response than meets the eye. But I seem to suffer from Obsessive Compulsive Skiporder. So I did indeed skip the dialog which was the same as when offering them the fruit beforehand. Offering them other items have different dialogue from the get go once you learn of the riddle, whereas the fruit offer starts off exactly the same, only with a different camera angle I didn't pick up on. And seeing how the space bare skips entire dialogue rather than current line as is common in many other adventure games, I skipped past the appended stuff. Hearing the same dialogue multiple times in an adventure game can be kinda grating to me, so I tend to skip dialog I've heard before. It's a nice joke though, and it would be hard to telegraph that it's coming since starting off with the same dialogue is a part of it. Single line skip instead of dialogue skip would've allowed players to catch it even if they skipped, but I must admit I rather like the skip function here. Especially when playing through the game from start up to the point to make a savegame to work from. Only solution for catching player behaviour might be either breaking it into 2 pieces of skippable dialogue, so if someone does skip the first bit it still hops into the second bit. Or potentially changing the dialogue a bit. When told "No thanks these are our only robes", you could have Vella cut them off, with the next line. Reflect that in the (default on) dialogue text with a - or ... to show they're about to be cut off. It'd hint to anyone not hitting space as soon as they see "Check it out. Fruit", but it might break character for Vella. She doesn't seem the impatient type who'll cut people off, even if she doesn't have a problem being an aggressive monster slayer. I'm sorry for the confusion, and my late reply in this. My bed beckoned, and now work is beckoning, so I will be a while answering any responses. If I'm really "lucky", Karma is going to kick me and I'll have to hunt for a bug which again turns out to be a usability issue with lazy users.
  6. You are correct. The fruit is the key. But I'd still say either I've hit a bug, or something might need to be clarified. Just replayed up to the point again. It's a much shorter game when you know what to do and can use the space bar. Anyways. Talk to the guards, ask to go it. Ask about the riddle. And when offering anything but fruit, I can't go in. If I offer fruit I get the dialog "Check it out. Fruit!" "No thanks" "These are our only robes, we don't want to get them all sticky" But hey, now they'll let me in. I have an inkling this isn't the right response to fruit upon having learned about the riddle. I did forget to actually ask about the riddle in one of the tries I made, but no worries, offering fruit would still grant me access. So I guess the bug is not that it'd accept anything, more that at least for me it fails to acknowledge a correct answer with proper dialogue.
  7. I tried after offering the art. Got the same response as before I'd even asked about the riddle. When I did not know about the riddle I tried to bribe them into letting me past and was rejected because, hey...it'd mess up their robes.
  8. Sure, going back to the clouds could be a bit confusing. And the fact that only the exit area had something new (rather entertaining with H'rmony calling out) could maybe potentially have been shined up. But as you said, it's likely to do with the gathering of fruit. Options to have avoided it would have been a) go the sierra route. You didn't get the fruit before leaving? Tough luck, hope you have a savegame back then. (Hello reason I never got anywhere in space quest before I skimmed a walkthrough for hints) b) force in you getting the fruit as a chain in the clouds (throw the fruit to Gus, have him throw it back to you but shift him a bit which would make it possible to fall on him..but that'd make his puzzle harder?) c) When you land on the ground, have the fruit from the tree (and maybe Gus) fall down with you if you hadn't picked it up up there, basically letting you complete the puzzle without it. Actually while walking to work this morning I was pondering tricks how adventure games could ensure you had an item in your inventory before you moved on. And most often it's using an item multiple times to ensure you have it before moving on. Having an event happen once you have all the needed items (Oh I hate those, at some arbitrary point when you enter a screen you'll get something to allow you to move on, no logic, just have to know when to go back there), or perhaps have you pick up one thing conceiling another or otherwise make you pick up something while getting something else (blanket over a box with stuff you need or similar) But yes, the cloud area felt a bit bare and pointless revisiting. And it was too soon to have major change happen for you to laugh at when they've been cut off from H'rmony for a long time and society has degenerated into despair and sulking halfway through clouds or whatnot.
  9. And please don't have they spayed or neutered. They'll just start complaining rather than fixing bugs ;-) In all seriousness. I hope there's a good bug tracking system in place, that they're easy to address. And that the entire staff, not just the programmers, will get to enjoy food, free time with loved ones and a sense of fulfillment as the fruits of their labour reach the eager masses.
  10. I found Vella's part rather easy to go with and most of the time found it clear what I were to do: Kill Moby Di.....Mog C'thu.....Mr. Choth. It seemed rather clear that I wanted to get off the clouds because he'd already been there (could maybe have gone with another hint about him having already left for Shellbyville. And the would be mayor's swearing at how his sandcastle kept getting ruined clued me in that he'd need a hand building that place if they were ever going to have the maiden feast with your special guest. Then again, I've been trying to play Night of the Rabbit right up to the point Broken Age was released, and have found myself feeling utterly at a loss as to what to do most of the time, so maybe I'm just adjusting. I guess that's the thing about adventure games. Make them too easy to figure out, and those who enjoy a challenge will be upset it's too easy. Make it too obtuse, and it'll turn away novices. I like how Monkey Island 2 and 3 gave you the option for an easier challenge...yet I never took it even if I never completed either of them, getting stuck on what to do. Some day, maybe. In that way I found Telltale's way of hinting in the Sam & Max episodes rather well done. The setting would vary how long before Max started dropping hints, and how obvious those were. Alas it only works when you have a small homocidal sidekick.
  11. Please pardon me if this has already been mentioned, a quick search of the forum yielded no result. After getting asked the riddle of Yorn I tried offering the piece of art as solution. The dialog made it sound like this was the wrong solution (Can't quote it, and my last save seems to have been an hour and a half earlier), but something about whether the item had children or pits in it? I end up retracting my statement and I guess "Yeah that was a pretty stupid guess for answer to the riddle, of course it's the fruit which has pits, it smells and is also for making little tree children right?" But as it turns out, my fruit was not even acknowledged as a riddle guess. I wondered if I had to ask to solve the riddle again, but got no such dialog option. Then I just tried walking through the door and was allowed. So either the piece of art was indeed the answer and the ensuing dialog just went way over my head, or there might be a bug in setting the state of the riddle to solved.
  12. Personally I like dialog trees as they are as long as they're interesting. Day of the Tentacle for instance had some really fun lines of dialog so you didn't mind running into a conversation where you felt it was tedium to go through options to see what would do something. I quite liked the Tales of Monkey island episodes Telltale did, but while they did have some funny moments, a lot of the dialog felt more like a chore you needed to get done rather than something you'd throw yourself at. Then again it also depends a lot on the kind of game. If you're making a humourous game, fun and interesting dialog trees are easier to do than if you were to try to build something semi/completely-serious. Same thing goes with looking at objects in the world. A game like Ben there, Dan that had a lot of fun observations made when you looked at them, which caused me to go around looking at all sorts of various stuff just to get a fun reaction. Other games had nothing interesting to say apart from the hints when you looked at the right things or asked the right questions. That's rather dull. The idea of minigames for dialog has been done before I think. Never played it, but didn't Leisure Suit Larry Magma Cum Laude feature minigames while the conversation ran itself, and how you played determined how well the conversation was going? I seem to have read that somewhere, but never played it. And for those who play an adventure game for an adventure game (an old-school one at that) I wouldn't want a minigame like that mixed up in anything important. Sam & Max had the whack-a-mole game which was kinda important, but the highway surfing, the colour book, battleships and the credits shooting gallery was just fun you could have if you wanted, or skip if you didn't. Speaking of Sam & Max I quite liked the dialog system there. Instead of showing what you'd say you'd just have general concepts (question, joke, what was that exclamation mark again?) and additional icons for specific topics. Not sure how old-school or not it would be, but a system like that could easily be worked into an actual conversation "tree". You start maybe from the middle, then you have 3 branches (lines) stiking out superimposed over the screen each with an icon for something you'd want to do. Any additional things you could discuss as a result of following one branch would branch out from there. Might need scrolling. If for some reason you were to make a branch where you could only chose one and that might alter what options you had later in the game so you couldn't go back, you could have the branches animate to fall off as a result to let you know you made a choice you would need to reload to do. Not sure this would be a good idea, but it would be implementable in the game like that. And if you really wanted to complicate things, you could make inventory items draggable onto parts of the tree. So if you'd asked about a silhouette of a person with a question mark (do you know any of the people around here?) you'd get some branches to ask about the specific people they knew. You might've found a letter from some guy, click or drag the letter onto the person question icon and the person might suddenly know something about who made the letter. Would make it possible to ask multiple things about an item rather than just "give letter to Jack the perpetually confused janitor" with not much idea what you'd ask when you do, or what result it'd be. It would make the conversations just as much an inventory based puzzle as the rest of the game (sans the pixel hunting) Alas I'm getting sidetracked. I'd like to keep dialogue trees as long as they're fun and interesting to throw yourself at. Just please refrain from too many of the "ask the same question 3 times to get something important to happen". If you get brushed off once, and you try once more and get an almost identical reply, you feel you're just wasting your time asking a third time. Sadly I've seen this happen before to the point where I'd had to lookup hints for a game to figure out how to progress, only to find out I needed to talk to the same guy about the same thing once more to get him to do something completely different and progress the game.
  • Create New...