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About meisjoe

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    Unholy Action Forum Commander
  1. It's a small part of a medium sized studio. The management IS part of the team. Management, in this case, isn't some people in a back office somewhere with no idea about what's going on on the ground. I don't know what to say other than you're just wrong, wrong, wrong. It's not like it's even fair to compare the complexity of making an adventure game with a game like some shooter with complex AI and engine stuff going on which is probably going to have a much bigger budget in the first place. It doesn't make any sense. What we should be doing is comparing how complex Broken Age is to make in comparison with games of a similar budget level. Well anyway, I'm not highly experienced, but I've been making games on and off for a few years now, and I've long ago learned to throw away my assumptions about how complex a particular project 'ought' to be.The game I thought would be a quick stopgap project we've now been making for 3 years. And when I'm thinking about the next games we have in pre-production I have on my list a 3D exploration game, a 2D adventure game and a 2D strategy game as my main choices. They're very different projects, and I can see how every one is going to get very complex in different ways. Finally, I recommend you find Anna Kipnis' talk on dialogue systems in Broken Age for an idea of how even a seemingly pretty basic system can blow up in complexity very fast when you consider all the factors. There's a link around somewhere in the forum. I'm not wrong wrong wrong and you're not wrong wrong wrong... We just have different opinions on the subject. I've seen Anna's lecture. Complexity is yet another aspect of game development that needs to be managed. A game can be infinitely complex, but budgets are finite. Making a game isn't just about what you can do... It's so much more often about "what's the best we can do - with what we've got." Going so far over-budget is a sign of poor management. In this case, I believe that poor management led to things be cut out of the game and that's really sad. Anyway, I enjoyed the conversation with everybody. Have a good one.
  2. I'm separating the team from the management. The team can only come in and give it their all everyday. Whether or not that effort results in a good, on budget game rests with the upper crust. You're talking about modular design. And it saves time, but it's not a freebie. Each level still has to be designed, created, and staged. And you might be able to reuse enemies, but then you get into AI behavior which can suck up an incredible amount of programming time. And these days you can't get away with pure Modularity - unless you want your game to look cheap. So yes. In my opinion, adventure games are 100% absolutely "easier" to make. What I mean is that adventure games are a lot easier to put together - not that it takes less talent or effort to make them. (Especially from a writing perspective.) That's not a slight on adventure games. (I've been playing them since you had to type in what you wanted to do...) A good adventure game can't be beat, in my opinion. Anyway, we're kind of going around in circles. As I said before, I don't think it was the scope of the game that was the problem. It was development time. They weren't getting things done fast enough... Just looking at the first half of Broken Age, it's very hard for me to believe that it took so long (and thus cost that much) to put together. Which leads me to believe that it was the WAY the game was made, rather than HOW it was made that led to problems. And that's an problem at the top... not with the team. Yeah! I'm glad they didn't make a smaller game too! Broken Age Act 1 had about as much game play as a single episode of a TellTale game (For about the same price as a whole season.) If they had made it shorter, there wouldn't have been anything there!
  3. When I think of what they achieved, and without publishers, I really and genuinely believe that they did an amazing job at managing what was a tricky project. In my opinion, coming in years overdue and unknown millions over budget on a point and click adventure game is a sign of mismanagement, plain and simple. This is an adventure game we're talking about. It should have been pretty straight forward. It was only "tricky" because they made it that way. It didn't need to be. I have a feeling (and I could be completely wrong) that it was the iteration process - combined with the enormous expense of keeping the team going that caused it to go on so long and thus go so far over budget. The scope of the game had to be reduced because of the length of development - not the other way around. But we're just having a difference of opinion... No big deal. It's easy to sit here and play Monday morning quarterback, so I'm really just making conversation... I'm not trying to be down on the DF team or anything.
  4. You raise some good points. I've often wondered if maybe things would have worked out better had they made less on Kickstarter. I think the bigger budget caused a lot of problems. Tim wouldn't have aimed so high. He could have got away with making something a lot simpler... As it is, I don't think the game ended up better for all the extra millions and years it took (is taking) to complete. And I definitely agree with you about different budgetary requirements between Daedalic and Double Fine... I think trying to run an honest to goodness indie studio in San Fran is nuts anyway. I'd imagine Double Fine probably spend as much on monthly rent than a lot of Indies spend on their entire game budget.
  5. If they had been funded by a publisher - there would never have been a game. They would have canceled it after Double Fine spent the entire budget and didn't even have half the game finished. To me, the documentary (which I really like) is more of a "how not to make sausage." Broken age is a nice game. It was just a very poorly managed project, in my opinion. Give $3 million to Daedalic and they could have made a half a dozen Broken Ages.
  6. I agree with you about Youtube. I've almost stopped using it altogether because of the comments. And it's that way on nearly every video. In fact, the comment doesn't bother me as much as it's 50 thumbs up do... It makes me feel like everybody in the world is an absolute crap head. That being said, I think part of what has haunted Double Fine these last few years has been that they seem to be making important decisions based on the "fanboy" section of their audience. Artists need people to provide honest feedback and that's not what you get from fanboys. Sometimes negative feedback is warranted, and sometimes it isn't but you should at least listen to what your customers (not just fans) are saying... Just my opinion.
  7. By that logic, I suppose they should just go ahead and release the game for free too? I'm not one of those guys who gave them a bunch of grief about the game being "late." Or about all that nonsense about stealing backer's money - or whatever people got so worked up about... But it does bother me that Double Fine seems to consistently "amend" some of their Kickstarter promises - whenever they think it will profit them to do so... And I think they know this is kind of a lame thing to do... Otherwise they wouldn't be asking for "permission" to do it. So anyway. I enjoyed Broken Age, and I'm excited to play the 2nd part. I'm just going to focus on that.
  8. Why the F not? You pretty much broke every other kickstarter "promise" you made regarding exclusivity. What's one more? This reminds me of when you decided to open up the forums to "slacker backers." I'll say the same thing then as I will now. You basically took people's money - promising certain things... and you've pretty consistently pissed all over them whenever you decided it convenient. Do whatever though... Anyway, bring on Act 2! I'm looking forward to it.
  9. The beard is back! Now it's officially a Tim Schafer game! Yeahhhhh!
  10. Movies costs hundreds of millions - and they only last an hour and a half...
  11. I don't know if it was because I've been playing adventure games for so long (before the point and click days) but I found all the puzzles to be really easy... The only thing that got me stumped was ((((SPOILER - when you had to go back for the piece of the ship at the lumber-jacks house.))))))) I don't like it when puzzles are so hard you have to get hints - but this game was definitely on the easy side, in my opinion. Tim did say something about it getting harder next time - so I'm looking forward to that. And I agree with frilansspion. In the old days, you had to keep a journal basically... If there was a phone number or something - you'd have to remember it... the game wasn't going to help you when the time came to use it.
  12. Sucks, but it was bound to happen. If anyone from DF is reading this - they should file a complaint. They could get it off Youtube anyway.
  13. Honestly, I wasn't enjoying it much in the beginning - but once I got passed the parts we've been seeing all this time in the Docs - I really started having fun. Good job guys! Anxiously awaiting part 2.
  14. After playing it - I only have two gripes really. 1st is that the puzzles are too easy... Almost to the point of not even being necessary. And the second it with the story. I think they should have stuck with Vella and left Shay out of it. Of course, the game is not finished yet - so maybe things will come together better in act 2. It's really hard to judge half a game, so I'm trying not to be too critical at this point.
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