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hipposexxxy

to Steam or not to Steam ? DRM is the question

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Hey guys, I'm re-posting this excerpt of exchanges from the Kickstarter comments here because I want to help DF avoid a potential poop storm (i don't know if I'm allowed to use pg 13 words here) as there seems to be alot of rage happening there, and I'm not sure how closely that is monitored.

marcus: Awesome, just as you said in my backer tier "exclusive access to the Beta on Steam". Really looking forward to it.

In case I was to subtle for anyone: THEY CLEARLY SAID IN THE BACKER TIER THAT THE BETA WILL BE ON STEAM. DON'T START BITCHING NOW BECAUSE YOU WERE TOO IGNORANT TO SEE IT BEFORE!

sambesi: Steam? Why the hell, Steam? I want a DRM-free version and not that crap. Couldn't you cooperate with GoG.com for instance? And then i also need a Humble account? What the hell? Why don't you just send me the key via e-mail? I'm really disappointed in you, guys. This was not the original idea. You have let me down, Double Fine. This is not cool.

Greetings from Germany (Btw: We are not big fans of services who are tracking us all the time)

joe annabi: Hey Marcus, settle down butt head. It's super crappy for those of us who have to stop watching the documentary episodes as they come out to avoid spoilers. I personally can't run steam games on my system. It makes my computer crash.

Treating this as a full release with regard to one aspect (documentary spoilers expecting you to have already played the first half) but not in all aspects (allowing for drm free downloads) doesn't quite seem fair. and quote all the backer tiers you want, but we're in undiscussed territory as the game has gotten waaaaaay bigger than it was going to be initially, and we all know this part 1 months in advance of part 2 biz was NEVER discussed. Which is fine, awesome even, because MORE AWESOME GAME. I'm on board. I really don't want to get off the ride, but will have to if I can't play the damn game.

I have faith in DF and their ability to not leave those of us without reliable steam access in the cold on this one, but at this point it seems like a really lame decision has been made.

Will Act 1 be coming to OUYA at the end of January as well? That would work for me at least, since I do have an OUYA which finally allowed me to enjoy the Cave in all it's glory. Sure I had to buy it a second time after realizing my steam purchase was causing my computer to over heat like crazy and eventually fatal error, but I don't mind supporting DF as often as I can if it means more quality games. If Broken Age Act 1 does become available on OUYA at the end of the month too would backers be able to choose that as their prefunded format via a download code or something? Either way, I'd get it. Just checking.

marcus: Joe Annabi: Try disable steam overlay. If the game is DRM free (doesn't say anything about the beta) you should be able to download it through steam and run the game executable without steam running.

Sambesi: This was indeed the original idea, it even says exactly this in the first backer tier. The "exclusive" thing isn't just a pretty word, it actually holds meaning. After the exclusive (see, here it is again) beta it will be available as DRM free download outside steam.

joe annabi: thanks Marcus, I will try that tomorrow! I still think you're being mean spirited for no reason about wording to other folks tho. The beta which is exclusively on steam will be over on the official release date at the end of the month, but Remo said above "When Act 2 is released, there will be a DRM-free version of the full game available on Humble, but Act 1 requires Steam to download." soooooo, the beta will have been over for a long time before backers are able to download Act 1 without steam - and that is lame no matter how you slice it. thinking further on the specificity of the words "exclusive access to the beta on steam" - it is the access to beta that is exclusive - so we can't consider Act 1 a beta once it's released to general sale. Just in case we weren't seeing eye to eye on what exactly we're calling the beta. The beta starts tomorrow, and ends when it goes on sale to the general public. So yeah, if I can't beta even after trying your suggestion, that's fine, but come public launch day, Act 1 should be available drm free outstide of steam by the promise of backer tier text.

oh, and fyi, I am Joe Annabi. K - hope that helps direct attention to putting out fires. sorry if too many words to care, but I'm a wordy dude who values context.

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As someone who voices his opinion about it on the KS (that it is imo a major letdown that Act 1 will be Steam-only), I wanted to drop in here:

1) Steam is DRM (and I will not argue with that)

2) While it is true that the Beta is advertised as Steam-only, the update in question seems to say that it is more or less a final version (and in all cases that there will be a release version that will be available for everyone before Act 2 releases)

=> That means that while the Game itself might be released DRM-free, the initial more-or-less standalone release of Act 1 will not. And that sucks, because it excludes me from further updates until everything is finished.

[Just to imagine: What would be the reaction if they had announced that Act 1 would be Linux-only and the Windows/Mac versions would show up with the complete game only? Technically it would be exactly as true to the provided promises as the situation at hand, but I think nearly everyone would agree that this would be something that would cause major problems.]

So why treating DRM-free as "not so important"? I'm not saying that the Beta needs to be DRM-free, but there should be a DRM-free version available the moment the Game goes to sale.

One reason I support games on Kickstarter is to support the platforms I care about (DRM-free & Linux), so I would like to see a DRM-free version available to the public. Which is also not true for Act 1.

While it is certainly not as worse at the things that happened on Shadowrun Returns, it is in my eyes a decision that doesn't really care about the spirit of the DRM-free promise, but only to the letters.

I really hope that you will fix this situation (as HBS managed to do with Shadowrun Returns)

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Steam has the capability to be DRM, but isn't necessarily (and I will not argue with that either).

I dunno. You already paid for the Steam Beta anyway, so you might as well make use of it. I personally hate DRM when it restricts me. Steam-DRM is pretty much the only form of DRM I tolerate because I don't feel restricted by it. Also, we still need to see if Double Fine will actually make use of the Steam-DRM.

Broken Age Pt. 1 is the first part of Broken Age. The first part is finished, yes. But Broken Age as a whole isn't. That will only happen when the second part is going to be finished. One half of a game isn't a full game, you know.

I guess I get where you're coming from, I can understand your frustration, but I don't share it in the least, even though I never would back a Kickstarter game project that wouldn't offer a DRM-free version to its backers.

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Steam has the capability to be DRM, but isn't necessarily (and I will not argue with that either).

I dunno. You already paid for the Steam Beta anyway, you might as well use it. I personally hate DRM when it restricts me. Steam-DRM is pretty much the only form of DRM I tolerate because I don't feel restricted by it. Also, we still need to see if Double Fine will actually make use of the Steam-DRM.

Broken Age Pt. 1 is the first part of Broken Age. The first part is finished, yes. But Broken Age as a whole isn't. That will only happen when the second part is going to be finished. One half of a game isn't a full game, you know.

I guess I get where you're coming from, I can understand your frustration, but I don't share it in your least. And your rationalization doesn't hold up in my mind.

I'm totally fine with you being OK with the DRM that comes with Steam.

But I'm not OK with it. And we got promised a DRM-free version (in fact, without that promise I would not have backed this project at all [at least for the game - the documentary might be worth it without getting the game]). While it is certainly true that we still get a DRM-free game eventually, it is just somewhat shady to drop that promise for the Act 1 release. And I'm not talking about the Beta, but for the general release, where anyone can buy Act 1, but Steam-only.

Would you be ok if they said "Act 1 will not be for your platform, but the whole Game will be mult-platfrom as promised."?

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Double Fine seriously needs to hire a PR manager, at least part time.

Once again their wording in backer updates is horrible, they needed to place emphasis on the fact that Act 1 is just a beta Kickstarter promised (that they renamed and polished to get more funds from non-backers to finish actual full game) and it is Steam only because they need infrastructure to quickly fix reported bugs and push updates to everyone (DF Anna wrote it somewhere on the forum recently). Instead they write as if Act 1 is a standalone game, and the need for Steam is not evident at all.

And that's even without whole embargo stuff hitting the fan.

Btw, Steam is a digital store. Yes, you have to install client to use it, instead of it being optional like GOG. But it does not and actually can not Manage Digital Rights (u know, DRM) of games that don't use SteamWorks, and we can be pretty sure Double Fine won't waste time integrating it in the game.

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Acorino, it's like this. I'm not going install, get or otherwise use a program to install, get or otherwise use the program I actually want. It's bad enough I have to install Windows (work). If Steam decides to open a webshop, where I can make an account and dl games and play offline: fine. If Steam requires me to get their client in order to get a game: pass.

And that's it, really.

The rest is exactly as Christian described. Sticking to the letter gives you the wonderful feeling of being right, while the rest thinks you're a douche. I don't see how it would inconvenience DF to distribute Act I, after the Beta is over, on all channels they want to use anyway for the full game -- and on the flip side, it makes people happy, and directly means more sales for DF. Seems like a win-win to me, but maybe I'm too simple to understand this.

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Double Fine seriously needs to hire a PR manager, at least part time.

Once again their wording in backer updates is horrible, they needed to place emphasis on the fact that Act 1 is just a beta Kickstarter promised (that they renamed and polished to get more funds from non-backers to finish actual full game) and it is Steam only because they need infrastructure to quickly fix reported bugs and push updates to everyone (DF Anna wrote it somewhere on the forum recently). Instead they write as if Act 1 is a standalone game, and the need for Steam is not evident at all.

And that's even without whole embargo stuff hitting the fan.

Btw, Steam is a digital store. Yes, you have to install client to use it, instead of it being optional like GOG. But it does not and actually can not Manage Digital Rights (u know, DRM) of games that don't use SteamWorks, and we can be pretty sure Double Fine won't waste time integrating it in the game.

But is is clearly not the the Kickstarter beta (or it will be only a short time). The way the update says that Act 1 will be a standard Steam release. So everyone (as in not a backer) can buy it! At least that implies the whole "Season Pass" thing in the "Launch Plan" section.

If that is not the case (i.e. that Act 1 will not go to public sale Steam-only) than they seriously need to make better announcements.

And to the "fact" that Steam isn't DRM: why the heck I need to install the Steam client to install the game?

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It's obvious that I am deeply disappointed with Double Fine's direction here, and this disappointment doesn't even have to do that much with Steam DRM (which I'd never put on my PC thank you very much).

I backed the Kickstarter because the 'freedom for games' idea was and always is entirely central for me. Never, ever would I support game crowd funding if the game supposedly is a Steam exclusive. You ask your fans for money to fund a game to have an alternative to large and influential publishers. Steam, however, is the largest and most influential digital publisher/distributor in the history of games.

To make the first part of Broken Age a factual Steam Exclusive for MONTHS should have raised far, far more of a 'poop storm' already, I'm sad to say.

The backers who actually understand what Kickstarter games are about and would never retrieve a game via Steam - out of a personal choice and valid concern over the console-like dependency between developer and distributor oozing into PC gaming - these backers get punished heavily.

What puts the icing on the cake concerning all those proceedings is that exactly these honest and thoughtful backers are now punished further: they're even barred from watching the documentary, as the latest update has made it clear that 2PP intends to put part 1 spoilers in future documentary videos without hesitation. As a backer, it seems, it's MANDATORY to embrace Steam.

If you do not, you can't enjoy the documentary any more and you're practically expelled from the community discussion.

It's_just_not_right_guys. Please, I beg you, stop this madness immediately.

Once again their wording in backer updates is horrible, they needed to place emphasis on the fact that Act 1 is just a beta Kickstarter promised (that they renamed and polished to get more funds from non-backers to finish actual full game)

Tim's explicit words describing part 1 in the July update were "polished and finished first half of the game"; the term 'beta' has been carefully avoided in all official communication since then. The lack of emphasis is entirely purposeful, I assure you that much. Yes, Early Access is for beta versions of games usually, but it is only used because DF also likes to avoid the term for what this game actually has become: an episodic release.

Btw, Steam is ...

...the market dominating digital distributor (70+% market share, more than google has in search engines), and also the distributor for which Double Fine, with its concept of temporary exclusivity, actually advertises. At the time, I really don't need to know more to know how deeply problematic this is.

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@Vainamoinen Would you just chill? The probability is they wont even use Steamworks CEG DRM, which mean that the game still is DRM-free, even if it needs to be downloaded via Steam. I cannot understand the anamosity towards steam, which is a hell of a good service. Sure they have market dominance, but they don't abuse that and it's not their fault other services cannot match them. Steam is NOT Spyware, malware or anything else like that, so why would you not have it on your PC?

Fair enough if you don't want to make use of the service, but don't get angry at Double Fine if you cannot play the game early due to your own misguided moral objections. In April you will get the game on Humble and play it. This has nothing to do with exclusivity, and more to do with the fact that Steam is a easy distributer to work with and makes it much easier for them to push updates out. If it bothers you THAT much, just download it from the myriad of piracy sites where it will be no doubt uploaded within seconds of it's release. You paid for it, right? So there's no problem.

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@Vainamoinen Would you just chill?

My arguments are offered here without anger.

The probability is they wont even use Steamworks CEG DRM, which mean that the game still is DRM-free, even if it needs to be downloaded via Steam.

If you install DRM drivers on your computer, which is what you factually do when you install the Steam Client, the idea that a game downloaded via such services would be DRM free is not sensible, in my opinion.

In April you will get the game on Humble and play it.

I am willing to bet it will be in Q3 at the absolute earliest.

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@ChristianSt, Vainamoinen

It was already said and decided long ago, and shown back in JULY documentary - they need to sell unfinished game in order gain additional funding to not substantially cut full game. As far as I remember, vast majority of backers was for it - of course we can wait a little longer to get better game! Well, this is it - they are selling the unfinished game, and we will wait longer. Only of course they can't say it's unfinished, because well... Who would buy something like that? And once again - everyone (not a backer) could buy the full game up until couple of weeks ago, so that hardly changed.

As for Steam... It was said from the very beginning that the game WILL use Steam, that Beta WILL be exclusive to Steam, so it was kind of obvious that by supporting this project you were supporting Steam. Whether you will install the client or not - it doesn't matter - part of Double Fine's funds will go to Valve anyway. And since you invested in them - part of YOUR funds. If you don't want to sponsor Valve in any way - you should stop buying games from all developers that have games on Steam or will have in the future. And this would be simply ridiculous... Most (if not all) gaming Kickstarters will go on Steam, or are planning to be Greenlit. Frankly, out of the top of my head I can't name ANY gaming Kickstarter that explicitly stated they will NEVER have anything to do with Valve. So I'm not sure where this idea comes from, that Steam is somehow bad for Kickstarter projects, or bad for indies in general. Developers themselves certainly don't seem to share this view.

ps. Actually, because you will have the legal rights to install and play Act 1, it will probably be legal to download it via torrent (depending on your country laws, of course, but I don't remember it being illegal anywhere, even in Germany). It's the content that matters, not method of delivery.

But yeah, they probably should've planned a DRM-free release once initial waves of bugs get fixed and constant updates become less necessary. They do have a partnership with Humble Bundle, after all... Maybe there is a reason why they didn't announce it? Maybe they had a deal with Valve that saves Double Fine money this way, or maybe they will probably do it later but don't have any solid plans to announce...

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@Vainamoinen Would you just chill?

My arguments are offered here without anger.

The probability is they wont even use Steamworks CEG DRM, which mean that the game still is DRM-free, even if it needs to be downloaded via Steam.

If you install DRM drivers on your computer, which is what you factually do when you install the Steam Client, the idea that a game downloaded via such services would be DRM free is not sensible, in my opinion.

In April you will get the game on Humble and play it.

I am willing to bet it will be in Q3 at the absolute earliest.

Fair enough on the other release being late, we never know. Bu on the DRM comment, it is entirely sensible to for the game to be DRM-free. What people don't seem to realize is that Steam is the distribution platform and is not DRM. Steamworks is the DRM, and that is entirely up to the developer of the game to decide to use or not. Most of the time, DF chooses not to use the Steamworks DRM. Now, if it really is the case that it doesn't use the Steamworks DRM, something that anybody will be able to tell you after it is released, then you can download the game through Steam, move it to another folder and simply delete steam, the game will still function properly.

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It was already said and decided long ago, and shown back in JULY documentary - they need to sell unfinished game in order gain additional funding to not substantially cut full game.

They actually don't (was it in the last episode? But that's off the table, at any rate, they use their own money now), and that aside, you do not gain more revenue by restricting yourself to one site/client (Steam), but by offering it in multiple ways.

The Beta, that certainly will use Steam (as said in the KS) ends when they sell the game on Steam (in two weeks?). After that, they have a two-part game, or an episodic game, if you will, and if the first episode is Steam exclusive, then every Backer ever who got on board because it read "In addition to Steam codes, we will also be offering DRM free versions" will feel snubbed. The fact that you can possibly twist the words enough to argue "entire game" does not mean "Act I on its own" is completely besides the point.

If they actually don't intend to sell Act I via Steam anymore (or not before Act II is out), then I agree with Christian that they seriously need to clarify a few things.

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1) Steam is DRM (and I will not argue with that)

So how do you wrap your head around games that ship on Steam that are DRM free?

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Steam is more a tool for delivery and updates, then DRM.

If anything, people should ask them to make the game being able to run without the client, but even then it should be done with a bit less anger then some comments I've seen here.

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It was already said and decided long ago, and shown back in JULY documentary - they need to sell unfinished game in order gain additional funding to not substantially cut full game.

They actually don't (was it in the last episode? But that's off the table, at any rate, they use their own money now), and that aside, you do not gain more revenue by restricting yourself to one site/client (Steam), but by offering it in multiple ways.

Um, they did, and they funneled money from the sales of Brutal Legend into the development for Broken Age. Presumably that and the other funding they secured is for Act 1. Any money gained from sales of Act 1 (which I assume will be releasing near the end of the month) which what today's release will NOT be as it's just the beta will go towards development of Act 2. When all is said and done, a DRM free version of the game will be available. The beta was always promised to be on Steam. There may yet be a DRM-free version released at the end of the month, there may not be, and we have no idea if it will be released on other storefronts either. Nobody but DF knows the answer to that question and are currently choosing not to address it... which really doesn't bother me. What is for sure is a DRM-free version of the game will be coming out. They don't want a DRM free version of the beta out because they wouldn't want an incomplete version of the game circulating around the internet giving everyone impressions of something that isn't the final product.

As to the topic of Steam itself: Yes, Steam is DRM, and DRM has been a hotly contested topic in gaming for a long time, what with SecuROM having existed on PC and stuff like Ubisoft's always-online DRM that was retired because they found it didn't work, or the latest SimCity being online only, or last year's Xbox One controversy. The problem with those is they provided no tangible benefit to the consumer while Steam does, even if it is DRM. The positives far outweigh the negatives for Steam. Free cloud saves for supported games, big picture mode, a massive library with extremely frequent sales (4 big sales a year plus daily, weekly, and weekend deals) among other things. There are other digital storefronts, some DRM-free, some not, but none provide the sheer convenience of Steam with its constant sales and wealth of features over the years. Sure, when Steam started out, it was absolutely awful, but they learned from that experience and have matured into a fairly healthy platform that is one of the biggest contributors to PC gaming today, for better or for worse, whichever way you see it. Things like Greenmangaming, GoodOldGames, and even Gamefly's digital store are fairly good too, but don't measure up to Steam. However, GoG offers the benefit of DRM-free (but doesn't get major releases of newer games) and GmG and Gamefly often offer constant coupon codes for 15-20% off new releases. Meanwhile you have things like Origin which don't offer nearly as big a library as Steam and has less features, not to mention EA and DICE royally screwing up the release of Battlefield 4 and before that EA and Maxis royally screwing up the release of SimCity on top of the game being a step back entirely from the others.

Sure, Steam may somewhat have a monopoly on the PC download front, but its largely because it does provide some benefit to the consumers. Whether or not you think it provides that kind of benefit to yourself is another thing, but there are far worse options that could control the PC market than Steam.

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As to the topic of Steam itself: Yes, Steam is DRM, and DRM has been a hotly contested topic in gaming for a long time, what with SecuROM having existed on PC and stuff like Ubisoft's always-online DRM <...>

It is not.

SteamWorks is DRM- and if the developer decides to integrate it could give cloud saves, achievements, items, workshop etc. Remove Steam and SteamWorks with it - and all your games with SteamWorks will stop working.

SecuROM is DRM. It does nothing but stop you from playing without original disc or with a badly made copy of it. Remove SecuROM Windows kernel driver - and all your SecuROM protected games will obviously stop working.

Steam itself - is not DRM, you can call it downloader if you wish, at a minimum that is all that it does. It downloads games files into some folder, installs them and keep them updated (when you have Steam running). After game installation you can remove Steam completely and games, who's developers chose not to integrate it into Steam will continue to work just fine.

Even better - in one of the parallel thread someone gave example of Psychonauts - it did actually implement Steamworks for achievments, but if you removed Steam would work just fine (without Steamworks features of course). So again, not a DRM - just an optional feature.

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Each one has their own notation for what steam is , i consider it as a platform where my games are kept fully updated and secure after logging in securely i can play the game i want, i dont see how steam restricts me from playing my games , there is a offline mode , recovery options and what not.

I believe steam is the most easiest way to do a beta release , i have seen almost every developer on steam do this , where as in they can create beta patches safely without affecting the main build and anyone can opt in to the beta patch and provide feedback it works fast , instead of wasting time hosting and providing drm free downloads, dealing with the feedback coming in from the public rather than a specific users and worst of all updating the drm free build with patches.

you will have to wait for a bit if you hate steam and want to play the drm free game only , dont spoil the mood by insulting others who just want to play regardless of the drm and gamers who backed double fine for a adventure game from them.

we are all eagerly waiting for the beta access , seeing these senseless posts make a pain to wait more

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No one is talking about the beta!

And seriously, if you don't want to read discussions about DF's release plans, then you probably shouldn't read a thread that's got that topic, and, if seeing that thread is too much, look into the forums at all. It's a legitimate topic. Just as a legitimate way of spending the time is to turn off the computer and go for a walk. I'll do that after I'm done eating, for example. It's a beautiful day outside.

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I view this as definitely a PLATFORM decision.

Think about it: What service can reach the most people? DF probably only had time for ONE approach since they were still working on the game literally just the other day. I have no idea how much work goes into releasing a game by itself or on steam or on another platform, but it just looks like to me that they wanted to keep most of their focus ON THE GAME and chose the platform that reaches the biggest audience. (Seriously, steam is incredibly hard to avoid these days if you're a gamer)

Although, I do agree, a warning should have been made. But I really don't understand the concern -- this is just for beta purposes and you will get the full copy free of steam eventually. I'm not really understanding why it's such a big deal to make a quick account to play it and never touch the account again?

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The Beta, that certainly will use Steam (as said in the KS) ends when they sell the game on Steam (in two weeks?). After that, they have a two-part game, or an episodic game, if you will, and if the first episode is Steam exclusive, then every Backer ever who got on board because it read "In addition to Steam codes, we will also be offering DRM free versions" will feel snubbed. The fact that you can possibly twist the words enough to argue "entire game" does not mean "Act I on its own" is completely besides the point.

I don't think interpreting "entire game" as not "only Act 1" needs any word twisting.

You don't interpret half of a movie as an entire move (unless its Peter Jackson of course :) )

You probably don't interpret "Act 1" of theater play as entire play

If the initial Kickstarter was about making first episode of the game, and later they held Epsiode 1 as DRM only without excplicitly stating in the description - that would look bad. But this is absolutely not the case, and anyway - this Act 1 will stil be avaliable. It will still be free. It wouldn't require you to sell your soul or anything - just downloading game through glorified downloader. Which you can later remove. And keep the game. This reaction is so disproportionate, it is as if you are forced to buy Windows 8 to play it or something :)

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This reaction is so disproportionate, it is as if you are forced to buy Windows 8 to play it or something :)

Well, if that was the case, I'd demand my money back. I'm not doing that, so I consider my personal reaction quite appropriate. I'm not screaming or shouting, just pointing this out and getting a little exasperated at having to explain the same thing again all the time (for which I apologise). What I'm also not going to do is to argue with you about words and letters. I said it was besides the point, and it's perfectly clear what was the intention when the KS was put up.

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I personally use Steam for most of my gaming, but I have to agree that I think DF absolutely should make a DRM-free version available for download from Humble Bundle when Act I is officially released on the 27th. Like someone mentioned before, going for an exclusive Steam release now effectively denies everyone who choose not to use Steam for one reason or another the ability to watch the documentary from now on and it feels more than a little iffy.

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It was already said and decided long ago, and shown back in JULY documentary - they need to sell unfinished game in order gain additional funding to not substantially cut full game.

They actually don't (was it in the last episode? But that's off the table, at any rate, they use their own money now), and that aside, you do not gain more revenue by restricting yourself to one site/client (Steam), but by offering it in multiple ways.

Actually they do. Tim specifically said it in his letter:

<...>

Tim:

Would we, instead, try to find more money? You guys have been been very generous in the tip jar (thanks!) but this is a larger sum of money we were talking about. Asking a publisher for the money was out of the question because it would violate the spirit of the Kickstarter, and also, publishers. Going back to Kickstarter for it seemed wrong. Clearly, any overages were going to have to be paid by Double Fine, with our own money from the sales of our other games. That actually makes a lot of sense and we feel good about it. We have been making more money since we began self-publishing our games, but unfortunately it still would not be enough.

Then we had a strange idea. What if we made some modest cuts in order to finish the first half of the game by January instead of July, and then released that finished, polished half of the game on Steam Early Access? Backers would still have the option of not looking at it, of course, but those who were sick of waiting wouldn’t have to wait any more. They could play the first half of the game in January!

We were always planning to release the beta on Steam, but in addition to that we now have Steam Early Access, which is a new opportunity that actually lets you charge money for pre-release content. That means we could actually sell this early access version of the game to the public at large, and use that money to fund the remaining game development. The second part of the game would come in a free update a few months down the road, closer to April-May.

<...>

(Letter in full)

And looks like the team ALWAYS had the intention of doing the beta on STEAM, so why are people just now getting upset? Or has their always been strife? I apologize, I haven't been on the forums hardly since this point.

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Actually they do. Tim specifically said it in his letter:

Yes. It has been subsequently revoked. I forgot where (as I said), but they don't use/need the money from the sales of the first part to make the second part now. So I did mean what I said.

And it's still not about the beta.

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And looks like the team ALWAYS had the intention of doing the beta on STEAM, so why are people just now getting upset? Or has their always been strife? I apologize, I haven't been on the forums hardly since this point.

I think i got it.

If DF views Act 1 as part of beta - then there is this phrase in Kickstarter tier 1 - "exclusive access to beta on Steam", meaning they break promise of beta being exclusive to backers (I personally thought it meant "beta access, exclusive to Steam")

If DF views Act 1 as release - then they should put it as DRM-free version because they promised DRM-free release. Only of course Act 1 can't be viewed as the release because it is not a complete game and not the game we pledged for - just a part of it.

So basically if you want, you can feel betrayed and the promises of Kickstarter broken.

If you don't - you don't.

Because really, there is nothing explicitly allowing this particular scenario or prohibiting it.

All of this multiplied by the fact that people held opinions what this Kickstarter means for 2 years and definitely not willing to change their mind just like that.

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Please read this article and understand why steam is preferred for those wanting to self publish their game

http://indiegames.com/2014/01/the_profound_effect_steam_can_.html

all i ask is give double fine some time to get the beta out first and smooth the game out and then start the process of the drm free requests, you dont want them to rush through things and have more problems

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Please read this article and understand why steam is preferred for those wanting to self publish their game

http://indiegames.com/2014/01/the_profound_effect_steam_can_.html

all i ask is give double fine some time to get the beta out first and smooth the game out and then start the process of the drm free requests, you dont want them to rush through things and have more problems

Yea, I think patience is a virtue here. DRM-free builds will be added to Humble pages when Act 2 comes out, and at that time the game will probably arrive on GOG.

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I think people need to work on reading comprehension skills. Mates, ya'll are talking in circles. Best thing to do is to just wait and see what's up.

If something is not to your liking once it's released, make a thread. But dissecting words and phrases right now is kind of getting nowhere. The issue has been raised enough for the team to see at this point anyway.

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