Jump to content
Double Fine Action Forums
Sign in to follow this  
DF_John

Sigil Symbol Suggestion Thread

Recommended Posts

Hi MASSIVE CHALICE backers!

We're beginning work on the sigil editor that Bloodline Backers ($100+) will be able to use to design their house sigils for the game. Sigils will be composed of SYMBOLS, chosen from a library created by Derek and other Double Fine artists - and we want your suggestions for symbols and symbol categories!

Even if you're not a Bloodline Backer, the sigils you see in the game will be built from layering and manipulating these symbols, so fire away and let us know what you'd like to see in the symbol library!

Here are a few early symbols we've used in previous concept art:

Wfv29R3.jpg

Sigils are made from layered symbols

Our goal is to let you manipulate layered symbols and set them to be your primary or secondary house color, so you can express a unique house sigil that will look great within the color palette and visual design of MASSIVE CHALICE.

Here's a quick take on using the BEE SYMBOL, layering, color-setting, and manipulation to create variations on the symbols above!

k1XBiOC.jpg

Concepts of Sigil use in-game

Hero Screen

iVDgZdF.jpg

Tactical Battle

rFSHTLA.jpg

------------

So please post your favorite SYMBOL and category ideas below!

Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty neat. Obvious symbols include

Gladius

Skull

Spiked Mace

Kraken

Axe

Crown

Scimitars

Lightning Bolt

Drop

Flagon

Eye of Horus

Rays of Light

Gammadion

https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-ash1/t1/p160x160/1002329_636944492991034_1953110486_n.jpg

The sort of symbols that are often included but no one wants to use include

Flowers

Tree

Thorns

Raven

Hammer

Bull's Head

Boat

Crosshair

Heart

Checkerboard

Rampart Tower

Nike Swoosh

Since you're avoiding religious iconography that means no iron crosses. A two-headed double-fine baby seems an entry that needs no suggestion to be in...Maybe a baby in-womb to represent re/birth? Umbilical-cord fetus.

If they lined-up right I'd do a fetus in the cranial cavity of a skull.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZL0RsR_Zbls/UD_hrK8MINI/AAAAAAABVF0/iu3b7_UCys0/s1600/sigils_poster_final.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like lots of the initial ideas.

Some general images that have fun elements or ideas:

b7801255a126db2e0fd12d85e8fecf50.png06ff3e1dad9c85aeb0ff9a0a53c7ab34.png179038d7b73ffca0cdc0769d70f3e797.png

c32eb91a3ee3faa9ba5f62584d4eebe9.pngbad8a81574e548c8e29fc8bda0678ac8.png

Also, some generic "Runic symbols" or something similar, that adds some alternative to the icon repetition. Perhaps using inspiration from older written languages:

Old Turkic

220px-Orkhon.svg.png

Old Mongolian

90px-Mongol_khel.svg.png

Smiles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

THANK YOU! And huzzah's for this particular and much anticipated update.

I've been thinking alot about this. (A plethora)

How many colors?

Will it be possible to use more than two colors for the sigil?

Ofcourse, selected banner color for each house will be the background.

But it would be great to combine two or three icons/symbols with diffrent colors.

The best option here would be a preset color selection/palette.

How many layers?

I created a few emblems for GTAV with the online editor which is prettymuch full tit, do whatever you want.

The results can be pretty amazing. However simplicity is more true to form I suppose.

And less is always more. So by limiting layers+colors, what the editor should have is a broad variety of icons/symbols.

Please NO wingdings type icons/symbols.

Because, no.

(Here is an emblem I made with the GTAV emblem editor.)

64f2b89d2921f4d5225c69102835cf752c7a289b_512.png

SIGIL ICON/SYMBOL LIBRARIUM

I've been browsing thru a lot of 'Waffenbuchs aka. armorials, depicting various family weaponshields.

And as with all heraldry there is a set of rules as to what goes on a sigil/shield.

- Weapons/equipment.

- Skulls/bones.

- Animals/creatures.

- Additional/decoration. Like wings, flames, horns, diamonds, flowers, etc.

(From the Wernigeroder Wappenbuch 1486 – 1492.)

426px-Wernigeroder_Wappenbuch_014.jpg

The example from the Wernigeroder armorial shows how uncomplicated a sigil can be.

Forget the bird above and the doodles and wankery. White skull on a black shield. Thats it.

("DEATH! I'm bringing it. Questions? Didn't think so.. DIE!")

It would also be pretty awesome if the iconography were depicting things and artifacts from Massive Chalice.

Familiar items like the caberjack's unmistakable weapon, or specific helmet designs. Dæmon claws etc.

;^)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More examples from the Werningeroder Wappenbuch.

1+2: Imperial Constantinople.

3+4: Emperor Ludwig of Bayern.

5: House Nosebleed.

6: The Phantom Blot.

7: Sir Lamehat.

428px-Wernigeroder_Wappenbuch_045.jpg

Misc.

419px-Wernigeroder_Wappenbuch_489.jpg

425px-Wernigeroder_Wappenbuch_056.jpg

Notice how most sigils/shields only have two colors, or three at most.

Theres even an example of runic/writing.

They were pretty basic and easy to read/identify. However as time progressed.

Things got a little more flashy eventually with ornate helmets and decorations etc.

Matching/elaborating on the basic shield motifs. Fashion, guys. Fighting style.

"Hell yea, im Dragon crew! Red shield, dragon is up here, on my helmet! Look!"

Which brings me to my point. How AWESOME wouldnt it be, if you could upgrade your HELMET.

Like, add wings or horns. Peacockfeathers, or rabbit-ears. I will do a separte poste on it tho.

Did someone say bunny ears?!

420px-Wernigeroder_Wappenbuch_138.jpg

;^)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Has three references. The ferret, the The vector (the spear is a vector symbol I rotated), and the grape leaf.

XEvXzzr.png

(I have the svg original I can upload if someone knows a site that takes those. This is the 21st century image hosts, start accepting svg....)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Old Turkic

220px-Orkhon.svg.png

Turks used scandi-style runes? Mind status = blown. That Indo-European connection through the middle east and asia

I expect the team will exclude sig runes.

Most anything by Mike Mignola has the style needed for heraldry

YALyQYMg_1901141413561.jpg

Also Daniel Martin Diaz is a good source of the Danse Macabre style.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here are some additional images that have semi-interesting elements, angles, or designs:

5683131a36e03e367f1fc08af2f02a63.pnga9e8be9154ae5dbfa27aefd19445b628.png

85dbabfb21ebe43ab4f4713c9d3d0006.pnge831884ce5d3f22bc1dc5aef89debf26.png

6f5438e6c5e116f9cc029cd48e5cf627.png

Smiles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awesome ideas you guys! We're going to blast this thread out with our next Teamstream announcement - hopefully we can get a lot more suggestions! :D!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hopefully we can get a lot more suggestions! :D!

There's simple polygons, constellations, planet symbols, silhouettes of objects in the world like a wheel or a cart, scales, goblets, a blindfolded face, eagles, Heraclitus and Democritus drama masks, infinity symbols, hands holding various objects, vessels, pieces of anatomy (femur bone, lungs), overlapping circles as in a ven diagram, chevrons, occult symbols like an eye of horus atop a pyramid or monolith, inversions on such symbols like the black null-seeing-eye set in an upside-down white mayan pyramid, and remember each piece doesn't have to be a singular object: it can be groupings of a repeated icon like three fleurs de lis or entwined snakes.

http://www.clker.com/cliparts/c/5/H/J/3/z/safety-signs-hi.png

http://galleryplus.ebayimg.com/ws/web/121115580506_1_0_1/1000x1000.jpg

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/59/29/42/592942ceec94c6b9190c07937d39b476.jpg

http://www.vector-finder.com/site-images/too_big/vector-logos-01.png

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-c_sYgfVeocg/T3L6Um-E-sI/AAAAAAAAAW0/zefl6Wh6ZDA/s1600/car-company-logos.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just tweeted out a link to this thread! We're compiling the For Reals list right now! Hopefully we can get some more suggestions! :D!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Man there needs to be stylish turtles. Mad turtles. Like all kinds turtle heads, whole turtles, shells. Man do it up. I recognize that isnt a turtle. Not sure how to change the image

IMG956244.jpg

IMG956244.jpg.0356382005121257653767ac8e

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Smiles: I like how that butterfly already seems to have a chalice hidden in it. Maybe a run of symbols that incorporate the Massive Chalice outline in subtle ways would be appropriate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd recommend to look at some ancient cultures. They have a lot of various symbols/patterns/fresques - asian temples, monasteries, arabic patterns, persia/assyria/mesopotamia...

Akshardham2.jpg

5406.jpg

01090133.jpg

01090024.jpg

britishmuseum8.JPG

01090011.jpg

graveVbox2.jpg

aat-mayan2-large.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is one of those things that does not make sense.

Why, oh why are you insisting on hobbling your donators with a pre-selected library of stuff?

My wife and I where terribly excited by the idea of getting to design a permanent sigil and other House oriented stuff.

A very personal, and permanent piece of my family entwined into what sounds like an awesome game.

Ever since the kickstarter ended I've tried contacting Double Fine through Kickstarter and checking these forums irregularly.

I have tried to keep in the loop on Massive Chalice, however the only contact the massive chalice team seems to see fit is twitch streams.

I have a life where gaming - while valued - is not the centerpiece. My family and business comes first. Why then, do you choose to lock up the information on Massive Chalice in those infernal twitch streams with no summary whatsoever?

When I looked at these forums a while back, they where empty. I've tried PMing on the kickstarter boards. I posted 7 days before the kickstarter project cleared, when the team first hinted they may use a pre-selected library of junk. I was ignored.

Why was this thread not pushed out to all the bloodlines backers? Other kickstarters regularly send out targeted information that only hits the tiers it's supposed to.

I want flexibility. I want to either create the outline myself, or to be able to import a picture and have it flattened to match the color scheming. Is that so much to ask?

Let me import a picture to your program, and then reduce it to mono-color. Don't even need to have fancy filters to make it a more artistic mono-color outline; although I am certain other backers would appreciate that.

Seneschul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Seneschul, MC Team was pretty clear from the Kickstarter FAQ at the early stages of MC, that because of budget, time, and keeping things consistent in-game, they were going to go with a 'pre-defined' library when it comes to sigil design. They mentioned early on that they would try to take feedback from backers (at the bloodline level or not) regarding the creation of the sigil library and how the tool will sort of work. I think they still plan to blast this topic out in one of their MC update emails. Most likely, the creation of the actual tool, and the content for that tool, will be in production for a while, so we'll get to have some input and feedback.

Smiles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Summary: I complained on June 20th. June 21st the FAQ gets edited, but the backers aren't informed.

Regarding this thread being email blasted to all backers - this thread has existed for 20 days. It's a little long to wait before email blasting your backers - you know, the fans who paid for all this and deserve to know this stuff?

Long:

@Seneschul, MC Team was pretty clear from the Kickstarter FAQ at the early stages of MC, that because of budget, time, and keeping things consistent in-game, they were going to go with a 'pre-defined' library when it comes to sigil design. They mentioned early on that they would try to take feedback from backers (at the bloodline level or not) regarding the creation of the sigil library and how the tool will sort of work. I think they still plan to blast this topic out in one of their MC update emails. Most likely, the creation of the actual tool, and the content for that tool, will be in production for a while, so we'll get to have some input and feedback.

Smiles

Interesting. I don't recall seeing any such thing in the FAQ before I put my money down.

*goes to find the reference*

Link

Interesting. the date on that portion of the faq is June 21st.

If you examine the post with my initial complaint ( Link ) you will see that my complaint predates the timestamp of the FAQ you reference.

Furthermore, if you read the entire thread you'll see there was no official response to this complaint. You'll also see I was not alone in my concern about the sigil editor.

So I was supposed to re-read the faq every day to be updated about this? The creators had time to edit the faq, but not post an update OR reply in the comments to the many people asking questions about sigils? Faq edits do not provoke an email blast to the backers.

Further damaging your statement/position is this thread's creation date: March 14th. It's 20 days later, no email blast has gone out to the backers.

This feels like sweeping it under the rug and hoping people don't complain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While focusing on a means for pairs of men to have babies in the game, provided with proto-babies, did the team forget its' backers?

sigrid-agren8.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Production is a long process. I'm willing to give the MC team the benefit of the doubt that this will likely be worked on a for a while. So far, the team has listened to our feedback about other concerns we have all had, and has tried to adapt. In the end, it is unrealistic it demand completely custom sigils. I understand your frustration. For instance, I'd love to have a 4 class in the game. But it was cut to keep in scope. It isn't something I was terribly thrilled about, but I understand that you can't get everything.

So far, the MC Team has been pretty transparent about their decisions. They can indeed go farther, with more regular updates outside of the Team Stream, and hopefully that is something they will address.

Fun pills and sleds for everyone.

Smiles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re Smiles wanting to be understanding:

Summary: I complained on June 20th. June 21st the FAQ gets edited, but the backers aren't informed.

Regarding this thread being email blasted to all backers - this thread has existed for 20 days. It's a little long to wait before email blasting your backers - you know, the fans who paid for all this and deserve to know this stuff?

This is a reason to not extend them the benefit of the doubt. I've extended it to them for almost a year. The game's projected release date is/was August 2014. 4 months away.

I will now be quiet and wait a few business days to see if there is an official response.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's pretty clear that you have your mind set already. Best of luck. Fun pills and sleds! May the bees in your bottle settle.

Smiles

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

anyway actual suggestions vs. images. Gonna do : Symbol Categorys, Symbols and then references.

Category Ideas

1.Shapes

2.Beasts

3.Architecture

4.Nature or Seasons

5. Arms and Armour

6. Flourishes or Decorative

Symbol Ideas

1.Crown Band ( or Knight Crown)- so people can create their own "unique" crowns (e.g. one with castles ,spikes or tentacles on top)

2.Crowns- would like to see a few if possible

3.Horns - Demonic and more Pan/Unicorn like ones

4.Two-Face or Faces divided into Two halves that you can mix and match easily

5. Female and Male figures divided into three parts (head/bust and pelvis+legs)- to create hybrids

6.Tear Shape - can serve as blood also

7. Thorns

8. Spider Web

9.Thorned Rose - probably would please Toreador Fans

10. Lion with the Mane Emphasized

11.A feline in a couchant heraldic position (see sphinx)

12. Feathered Wings - Bat might be interesting also

13. leech - medicine!

14. crab claws- could be interesting for make-your-own-chimera

15.Spires - as in towers

16. Cat Eye/s- see make-your-own-monster /edit a face

17. Profile and Front Facing Female + Male Heads

18. Profile view of Monstrous Jaws (e.g. Shark)

19. Tentacle/s - ideally singular and like ones you would see on Ursula (if you wanted to make some weird siren octopus or octo-lion)

20.Leaf - seems to fit with the changing of seasons

21. Clenched Gauntlet - seems obligatory

22. Hand Reaching up

23. Barbs- may be redundant with thorns

24. Serpent Eye/s

25. Human Vein - seems like it could be good if put to creative use

26. Tree Roots

27. Branches

28. Disembodied Arm+ Hand and Disembodied Leg (maybe if you don't mind taking it from isle of man)

29.Serpent Head (profile) + entire serpent - could be used if people wanted to do a Medusa type figure aside from chimeras

30.Iron Maiden- unsure if I want to see this because of Hellboy...

31.Iron Mask

32. Gauze - could see this being used creatively: blind man, part of a garment,etc. (granted a banner may serve this purpose)

33. Gem/Ruby- see Zelda games (represent wealth and people could use them in creative ways (e.g. gem eyes)

34.moth or butterfly

35. cocoon

36. Larva - no I haven't been watching Silence of the Lambs lately O_O

37.Collar- spiked? (may be redundant of no. 1)

38. Spikes or Stakes

39. Praying or just Regular Mantis

40. Serpent Tongue

41. Waves

42. Androgynous Face (just the features)

43.Dissected Fish (for Mere-creatures)

44. Frog...frogs - dissection gave me that sudden idea

45.Horny Toads could also be interesting O_o

46. Snow Flake- sounds kinda corny, but I think if you go with an atypical design. It could be neat + culminated may result interesting look

47. Variety of Helms - profile and front view

48. Skeleton Parts - could easily be arranged in different styles

49. Cherub Figure

50.Caterpillar - in three separate parts might be interesting

--------

Ones I suspect will be in high demand

1. Wolf Head - STARKS

2. Dragon and separate heads aka Hydra - TARGARYENS

3. Hounds- CLEGANES

4. Saliant Lion- LANNISTERS! (also one of the most common animals found in coat of arms)

5. Saliant Stag- BARATHEONS!

6. Flayed Man? - eh not sure how many would want to be the Boltons

6. Gear Cog- for Steampunk Fans and...the few die hard Gears of Wars fans

8. Spear (cut in half for piercing)- to go with the sun (MARTELLS!)

9. Crescent moon- popular

10. Singular Sword (perhaps with tip that can separate for piercing)

11. Singular Arrow (perhaps with tip that can separate for piercing)

12. Bow

13. Regular Eye - Illuminati

14. Horse- Darkhorse

15. Sheep- Blacksheep

16. Crocodiles- House Scare Archer

17. Octopus or Kraken- OCTOPUS and potentially House Cthulhu

18. Buddha Belly - for those few pursiing House Cthulhu

References

1. $(KGrHqVHJEgFEQEwjY!+BRJ!YBHj+Q~~60_35.JPG

2. incisioni_disegno6.jpg

4. thumb.jpg

5+43. example3t.png

10. kimba_jungle_1.jpg

11. 3d.gif

22. Reaching_Hand_by_thibert.jpg

25. (see also 7 and maybe 26) picture-107.png

42. Moon_face.gif

46. snowflakes.jpg

47.page21cweb.jpg

48. cb54857aa2135a434cae0f1a07193d56.jpg

---doing my part to add to the Dev's misery.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello, I'm a bloodline backer and I'm happy I saw this thread. I'd really like to see some coat of arms.

For example, this is my family's coat of arms. If this could actually somehow make it into the game (perhaps without the name banner to make it universal) I would be amazed.

dancy_large.gif

dancy_large.gif.73d410944fbf515e8e27909f

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...