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Full Throttle Remasterd?

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In the 2PP Grim Fandango retrospective they also talked about Full Throttle a little and i guess you guys asked Disney about getting to re-do it also?

Have they said no or is it in the works but you havn´t got the "go ahead" yet?

I would love a remasterd version of Full Throttle since it´s my favorite game of all time.

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This is the first time that Disney has even shown an interest in any game that wasn't Star Wars, so right now Double Fine is treading completely new territory. I'd imagine that the possibility of companies licensing other LucasArts adventure properties in the future depends on how well Grim Fandango Remastered is received and/or how well it sells.

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Perhaps that DoTT HD remake can get continued or restarted as well.

Then all the Lucas Arts classics kinda should be redone :)

Outlaws, Full Throttle, Loom, Indie games, Dark Forces etc.

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I think it's a pretty safe bet that if Grim's re-release is successful we'll see more remasterings (I'd like to see Curse and Escape get a remaster, especially if they can add a point and click interface to the latter, and fix bloody Monkey Combat!), maybe even new games. Disney won't just sit around and do nothing if they know they've got a good thing going.

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The only new Monkey Island game they should make is Ron Gilberts third and final game as he always invisiond it. But sadly Ron is only interested to do it if he owns the IP and has full control/"final cut" over the project and they are not interested in selling the IP to him at any cost he said to me when i e-mail:ed him a few months ago...

Couldn´t they just be good guys and sell the man his creation back? Is that too much to ask for?

Hoping they would have a change of mind but im not holding my breath...

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Lets wait until he hear about what this remastering is expected to sell.

Im still certain that it has to clear 2-3 million copies.

If this doesnt earn them millions of dollars, no more will be greenlit.

Telltale has talked about doing Dott episode game.

Monkey island would be nice. but again but again Ron doesnt wanna compromise, and i can respect that, i respect a person who stands by his personal values no matter what, i would rather never have another monkey island game, that have one where a big publisher or some guys in suits is making the decision to maximize sales.

I just hope that Double fine has full freedom in Grim, but time will tell, i'm definitely sceptical until i see the end result and until i see a PC version.

If the copyright system worked like it should, it should cost a company x % of its yearly income to maintain an IP. so that if they dont use IP's to make money, they dont deserve to have them. Or they should simply revert back if not used in x years.

Im sick of big publishers sitting on good game IP's and not using them. Instead of giving them to developers who could make good indie games with them.

Dungeon Keeper, Monkey Island, well all the Lucas Arts point n click. Blood ip blocked by Atari, wouldn even allow Jace Hall to release a free remake.

Recent years ive just seen so many big publisher abuse and taking a big dump on game IP's from my childhood that i would, that has been absolutely ruined, because the decisions are made by people who had zero clues about gaming or what made the original game or games great. So its hard to not get distrustful .

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Full Throttle Remake - I would put my lips on that!

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmwwa! :-*

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I don't really know sh*t. But I was under the impression that aside from the original Monkey Islands and DOTT, Full Throttle was probably the most successful (financially) Tim Schafer Lucasarts game. I wouldn't be surprised if it's on a checklist, I'm actually surprised they went for GRIM first, considering it's often cited as a bomb, gives me hope.

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I was under the impression that aside from the original Monkey Islands and DOTT, Full Throttle was probably the most successful (financially) Tim Schafer Lucasarts game.

I've heard the same thing said, and directly from Tim. My impression of the situation is that it left the strongest impression with its fans and also has the most loyal, and therefore also vocal, fan base. I think that one of the major reasons that this might be the case is because Grim has a certain timeless quality to it due to its unique art direction and plotting. I still think that Monkey Island is still the game that people are likely to remember most fondly, but I'd also say that Grim Fandango was a close second.

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I don't really know sh*t. But I was under the impression that aside from the original Monkey Islands and DOTT, Full Throttle was probably the most successful (financially) Tim Schafer Lucasarts game. I wouldn't be surprised if it's on a checklist, I'm actually surprised they went for GRIM first, considering it's often cited as a bomb, gives me hope.

The weird thing is that Grim Fandango is always cited as being a marketplace failure, but at the time LucasArts actually said that it exceeded sales expectations.

It seems that all of these articles that said that Grim Fandango was a bomb just liked to paint the late 1990's and early 2000's as doom and gloom for adventure games, without really doing any investigative work into the validity of their claims.

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The only new Monkey Island game they should make is Ron Gilberts third and final game as he always invisiond it. But sadly Ron is only interested to do it if he owns the IP and has full control/"final cut" over the project and they are not interested in selling the IP to him at any cost he said to me when i e-mail:ed him a few months ago...

Couldn´t they just be good guys and sell the man his creation back? Is that too much to ask for?

Hoping they would have a change of mind but im not holding my breath...

Not to open this can of worms again, but Ron never owned it in the first place, so there is no "getting it back" :

1) As an employee of Lucasarts it was his paid job to design and make original games. He seemed fine with this when he was making the games, why does he want to change the deal now?

2) He had the original idea for Monkey Island and led the project, but it was a group effort - why should he get control of the copyright in all the music, graphics and so on? He didn't pay any of those artists or musicians himself.

I understand that it can be painful not to own something you created, but there's nothing sinister about a company paying someone to produce work. His requirements are neither realistic nor reasonable I'm my estimation, as much as I sympathise with his desire to be in charge of the franchise again.

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If anyone hasn't seen it, a fan by the username of luisimage made an awesome HD paintover of a scene from Full Throttle:

FT_comp_zpsdcc02f6b.gif

It'd be a lot of work to do the whole game this way, but that image is a great benchmark for how the art could be redrawn at a higher resolution while retaining the essence of the original art direction. More details in this thread.

Lets wait until he hear about what this remastering is expected to sell.

Im still certain that it has to clear 2-3 million copies.

Disney, Sony, and Double Fine would have to have gone crazy to expect the Grim Fandango remaster to sell that much. We are talking about a re-release of a more than 15-year-old adventure game that wasn't even a huge hit in the first place.

You might be interested in Ars Technica's reverse-engineered sales statistics on Steam. On Page 2, they estimate that 4% of the distinct titles on Steam (the top 110 games) account for 50% of the sales, and each of those games has sold 1.38 million copies or more. The vast middle ground of titles on Steam sell somewhere between 10,000 and 110,000 copies.

As for Grim Fandango, it sold about 95,000 copies up through 2003 in North America, excluding online sales. Total cumulative worldwide sales are estimated between 100,000 and 500,000 units. (See Wikipedia for details.)

Even Brutal Legend, Tim Schafer's most successful game to date, had only sold about 1.4 million copies as of February 2011. (Source.) I assume that's across all platforms (PS3, Xbox360, PC). I imagine it's sold more now, especially with the Humble Bundles pushing lots of inexpensive copies, but I don't have those numbers to hand.

I assume the Grim Fandango remaster will have a modest budget to fit modest sales expectations, but it'll still be terrific to have the game available again!

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If anyone hasn't seen it, a fan by the username of luisimage made an awesome HD paintover of a scene from Full Throttle:

FT_comp_zpsdcc02f6b.gif

It'd be a lot of work to do the whole game this way, but that image is a great benchmark for how the art could be redrawn at a higher resolution while retaining the essence of the original art direction. More details in this thread.

Lets wait until he hear about what this remastering is expected to sell.

Im still certain that it has to clear 2-3 million copies.

Disney, Sony, and Double Fine would have to have gone crazy to expect the Grim Fandango remaster to sell that much. We are talking about a re-release of a more than 15-year-old adventure game that wasn't even a huge hit in the first place.

You might be interested in Ars Technica's reverse-engineered sales statistics on Steam. On Page 2, they estimate that 4% of the distinct titles on Steam (the top 110 games) account for 50% of the sales, and each of those games has sold 1.38 million copies or more. The vast middle ground of titles on Steam sell somewhere between 10,000 and 110,000 copies.

As for Grim Fandango, it sold about 95,000 copies up through 2003 in North America, excluding online sales. Total cumulative worldwide sales are estimated between 100,000 and 500,000 units. (See Wikipedia for details.)

Even Brutal Legend, Tim Schafer's most successful game to date, had only sold about 1.4 million copies as of February 2011. (Source.) I assume that's across all platforms (PS3, Xbox360, PC). I imagine it's sold more now, especially with the Humble Bundles pushing lots of inexpensive copies, but I don't have those numbers to hand.

I assume the Grim Fandango remaster will have a modest budget to fit modest sales expectations, but it'll still be terrific to have the game available again!

Oh wow. that looks absolutely AMAZING. now thats how you should do a HD remastering jesus :)

Yeah i hope your right. because if it doesnt, it will definitely be the end of remastering with permission or support from Disney and sony.

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Oh wow. that looks absolutely AMAZING. now thats how you should do a HD remastering jesus :)

Yeah, it's pretty great! My only minor critique is that it's a tad too shiny and clean. For example, some of the metal in the original low-res version looks rusted, like that corrugated metal sheet in the bottom left corner, whereas in the HD paintover it looks brand new. But that's something that could easily be tweaked if this were a real project. :)

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As for Grim Fandango, it sold about 95,000 copies up through 2003 in North America, excluding online sales. Total cumulative worldwide sales are estimated between 100,000 and 500,000 units. (See Wikipedia for details.)
The problem with those figures is that it's by an independent company (since LucasArts didn't release sales figures), so it didn't include online sales or sales directly from LucasArts (which surely accounted for a great deal of the sales, especially considering this is the 1990's we're talking about, at a time when LucasArts still thrived on direct sales). Those figures are likely way off since LucasArts stated that Grim Fandango met sales expectations domestically and exceeded them worldwide (and I highly doubt their domestic sales expectations was only 95,000 units).

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As for Grim Fandango, it sold about 95,000 copies up through 2003 in North America, excluding online sales. Total cumulative worldwide sales are estimated between 100,000 and 500,000 units. (See Wikipedia for details.)

That Wikipedia article is flawed (for one thing, the article is cites is from 2001 at the latest, not 2003). Tim revealed that Grim Fandango sold 500,000 units (and I'd trust his word over JustAdventure) which would have been a great success, but the game cost a lot more to produce than expected.

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The only new Monkey Island game they should make is Ron Gilberts third and final game as he always invisiond it. But sadly Ron is only interested to do it if he owns the IP and has full control/"final cut" over the project and they are not interested in selling the IP to him at any cost he said to me when i e-mail:ed him a few months ago...

Couldn´t they just be good guys and sell the man his creation back? Is that too much to ask for?

Hoping they would have a change of mind but im not holding my breath...

Not to open this can of worms again, but Ron never owned it in the first place, so there is no "getting it back" :

1) As an employee of Lucasarts it was his paid job to design and make original games. He seemed fine with this when he was making the games, why does he want to change the deal now?

2) He had the original idea for Monkey Island and led the project, but it was a group effort - why should he get control of the copyright in all the music, graphics and so on? He didn't pay any of those artists or musicians himself.

I understand that it can be painful not to own something you created, but there's nothing sinister about a company paying someone to produce work. His requirements are neither realistic nor reasonable I'm my estimation, as much as I sympathise with his desire to be in charge of the franchise again.

You are so right, but now that Lucasart is no more Disney would have no problem selling the IP to Ron you would think. (but it´s maybe some "Pirates of the Caribbean" shit that´s the problem)

The ultimate thing would be if Ron, Tim and Dave Grossman owned, wrote and designed the game, Peter Chan did the artwork and the people at Double Fine made the real Monkey Island 3.... You can always hope :)

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If anyone hasn't seen it, a fan by the username of luisimage made an awesome HD paintover of a scene from Full Throttle:

FT_comp_zpsdcc02f6b.gif

It'd be a lot of work to do the whole game this way, but that image is a great benchmark for how the art could be redrawn at a higher resolution while retaining the essence of the original art direction. More details in this thread.

Lets wait until he hear about what this remastering is expected to sell.

Im still certain that it has to clear 2-3 million copies.

Disney, Sony, and Double Fine would have to have gone crazy to expect the Grim Fandango remaster to sell that much. We are talking about a re-release of a more than 15-year-old adventure game that wasn't even a huge hit in the first place.

You might be interested in Ars Technica's reverse-engineered sales statistics on Steam. On Page 2, they estimate that 4% of the distinct titles on Steam (the top 110 games) account for 50% of the sales, and each of those games has sold 1.38 million copies or more. The vast middle ground of titles on Steam sell somewhere between 10,000 and 110,000 copies.

As for Grim Fandango, it sold about 95,000 copies up through 2003 in North America, excluding online sales. Total cumulative worldwide sales are estimated between 100,000 and 500,000 units. (See Wikipedia for details.)

Even Brutal Legend, Tim Schafer's most successful game to date, had only sold about 1.4 million copies as of February 2011. (Source.) I assume that's across all platforms (PS3, Xbox360, PC). I imagine it's sold more now, especially with the Humble Bundles pushing lots of inexpensive copies, but I don't have those numbers to hand.

I assume the Grim Fandango remaster will have a modest budget to fit modest sales expectations, but it'll still be terrific to have the game available again!

OMG! Shut up and take my money!

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Yeah, it's pretty great! My only minor critique is that it's a tad too shiny and clean. For example, some of the metal in the original low-res version looks rusted, like that corrugated metal sheet in the bottom left corner, whereas in the HD paintover it looks brand new.

I agree with this. While it's a really impressive piece of work, I would not want a FT special edition to look like that. It all looks very smoothed over and plastic - almost like a Pixar movie. It's a similar problem to the Monkey Island special editions - all the grot and rot was taken out. It's also a lot lighter and doesn't use the shadows as effectively - it's lost the stylised Mignola-esque look of nice thick lines and deep shadows.

Conversely, I'd want a DOTT special edition to look indistinguishable from a cel-painted Chuck Jones cartoon!

The most important detail with the HD remasters of these editions for me, however, would be that they include the beautiful, timeless original versions so that they can also be experienced by a wider audience.

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Yeah, it's pretty great! My only minor critique is that it's a tad too shiny and clean. For example, some of the metal in the original low-res version looks rusted, like that corrugated metal sheet in the bottom left corner, whereas in the HD paintover it looks brand new.

I agree with this. While it's a really impressive piece of work, I would not want a FT special edition to look like that. It all looks very smoothed over and plastic - almost like a Pixar movie. It's a similar problem to the Monkey Island special editions - all the grot and rot was taken out. It's also a lot lighter and doesn't use the shadows as effectively - it's lost the stylised Mignola-esque look of nice thick lines and deep shadows.

Conversely, I'd want a DOTT special edition to look indistinguishable from a cel-painted Chuck Jones cartoon!

The most important detail with the HD remasters of these editions for me, however, would be that they include the beautiful, timeless original versions so that they can also be experienced by a wider audience.

I think part of the problem is that many of those old games looked grittier than they actually were, because they were low res conversions of scanned art. So when I compare the Monkey Island special edition backgrounds to the originals that were scanned, there's not much difference, but the pixellation and colour reduction introduced grit more than anything else:

mi-map3.jpg

So I'm not so sure that the grot and rot was all as intentional as we thought. Certainly, I remember the original Monkey Island as having an all around smoother look, and I think that's probably partly because the graphics weren't based off scans.

Still, it's true that for whatever reason we percieve these older games as having a grittier look, and that's something worth taking into account when making any updated version.

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I think part of the problem is that many of those old games looked grittier than they actually were, because they were low res conversions of scanned art.

Sure, I think that's true. Good post!

In my case, with regards to that corrugated metal sheet in Full Throttle, I wasn't actually referring to the detail so much as the color: in the original low-res version, there are these orange-brown pixels on the sheet that I assumed was rust, as if Maureen salvaged that sheet but it wasn't in great condition. There are some similar orange-brown pixels on a few of the other metal objects in the room.

But looking at it again and thinking about it more, I'm not sure if it actually was meant to be rust or if those colors are just part of how the light is hitting the objects and reflecting the color of the room or something. After all, there's one such orange-brown pixel on the television screen -- and that's glass, so it couldn't rust. I'm not an artist, so if anyone has a stronger idea what those orange-brown colored pixels are about, I'd be curious to hear what they had to say.

I would say Ben (TimeGentleman) still has a point that the overall impression the Full Throttle HD paintover gives is a bit lighter and smoother than the low-res, though, whatever the contributing factors may be.

As for the Monkey Island Special Editions, I've never played them aside from a couple minutes spent with the first. My vague impression from a distance (i.e. mostly via screenshots) is that I sometimes had small quibbles with the MI1 SE art, but the MI2 SE art generally looked pretty good to me.

I think remakes with an option for the original art are a great way to go to when possible, because that should generally please everybody. Of course it isn't always feasible to do that for technical reasons. Personally I don't even need remakes and will be happy if Disney just re-releases more LucasArts classics on GOG, Steam, or wherever in their original form. There's a few of those classics I don't own (DOTT, Zak McKraken), and even the majority that I do own I'd like to see more readily available to others.

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KestrelPi: they also did tests to see how the art scanned in, though. I would guess that they did cleaner original art knowing that it would gain a layer of grime. I'm sure they could have achieved a cleaner look if they wanted to. Re. Monkey 1, it probably depends on which version you look at, but I'd argue that it still aims for that dirty lived-in feel, at least in some locations. The Scumm Bar, for instance - everything's cracked, stained, ripped, filled with holes and they use loads of dithering.

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I actually agree with your original assessment about the corrugated iron. There's definitely rust in the original.

As for grittiness in general, I think it's just very difficult to tell how much of it was intentional and how much of it was just a product of the method.

But either way, grittiness isn't my problem with the Special Edition artwork (mostly the first game actually, I think the second does a more decent job) is that I just think they took a few too many liberties stylistically. They have a very definite visual style, and they didn't quite get it. (Again, they did better second time around)

I actually don't mind the Full Throttle example above. Sure there are a few things that could look a little grimier, but what I like about it is that it's still very much in the style of the original.

As for Grim Fandango, I'm excited that Double Fine is in control, because projects overseen by Tim and Co. always have a keen understanding of style, and I know that they will be able to keep the essence of what made Grim Grim while improving the assets for modern systems.

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I actually agree with your original assessment about the corrugated iron. There's definitely rust in the original.

Cool, I'm glad I wasn't crazy, then.

I actually don't mind the Full Throttle example above. Sure there are a few things that could look a little grimier, but what I like about it is that it's still very much in the style of the original.

I was very impressed with it, too (which is why I shared it, of course). Quibbles aside, I've rarely seen an HD re-imagining that was so faithful.

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As for Grim Fandango, I'm excited that Double Fine is in control, because projects overseen by Tim and Co. always have a keen understanding of style, and I know that they will be able to keep the essence of what made Grim Grim while improving the assets for modern systems.

Yes, totally! We'll all have to hope that if FT Special Edition happens, DF will do that too!

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Perhaps it's just me but I don't really need or want a remaster of Full Throttle. In my mind there's only one thing they could do to improve it, which would be to use higher-quality audio assets, everything else is perfect. Unlike Grim Fandango which suffers from all kinds of issues due to being an early 3D game, I find 320x240/256 color to be good enough for nice-looking 2D games, and the art of FT was exceptional. I like the pixelated look of the game, it's what I fell in love with as a kid and I always play it without any filters so to me any graphical enhancement would just be a side-grade at the very best, and MI:SE at worst.

The same goes for DOTT, The Dig, Indy 4 etc. Improved audio would be nice but I don't really have any interest in anything else. I guess it could be interesting to play the games using high-res scans of all the original background art, but that's probably not possible and it would still leave the characters. I admit that image of Maureen's workshop looks good, but only because the characters are faithful to the close-ups in the game instead of trying to re-imagine the bunch of pixels into some other nondescript art style with random shapes and too much shading...

I certainly don't mind them trying though, if only to keep the games "in print" so to speak, as long as the original versions are accessible as well. And remastered or not I'd re-buy them all on Steam or GOG just because.

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As for Grim Fandango, I'm excited that Double Fine is in control, because projects overseen by Tim and Co. always have a keen understanding of style, and I know that they will be able to keep the essence of what made Grim Grim while improving the assets for modern systems.

This. Tim's writing may be the reason I started watching Double Fine, but I actually think the biggest reason they're my favourite studio, is that they're incredibly versatile and will utterly commit to a particular game's aesthetic down to the most minute details. What can I say, I'm a sucker for style.

Between the kickass art department, and the shader voodoo of coders like Oliver, I'm sure we'll get some cool, unexpected graphical upgrades, even if they don't have the time/money/assets to retouch everything perfectly.

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They could certainly improve the puzzles a bit in Full Throttle. Even Tim struggled on his playthrough.

Plus the "action" sequences could be a hell of a lot more fun to play.

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Perhaps it's just me but I don't really need or want a remaster of Full Throttle. In my mind there's only one thing they could do to improve it, which would be to use higher-quality audio assets, everything else is perfect. Unlike Grim Fandango which suffers from all kinds of issues due to being an early 3D game, I find 320x240/256 color to be good enough for nice-looking 2D games, and the art of FT was exceptional. I like the pixelated look of the game, it's what I fell in love with as a kid and I always play it without any filters so to me any graphical enhancement would just be a side-grade at the very best, and MI:SE at worst.

The same goes for DOTT, The Dig, Indy 4 etc. Improved audio would be nice but I don't really have any interest in anything else. I guess it could be interesting to play the games using high-res scans of all the original background art, but that's probably not possible and it would still leave the characters. I admit that image of Maureen's workshop looks good, but only because the characters are faithful to the close-ups in the game instead of trying to re-imagine the bunch of pixels into some other nondescript art style with random shapes and too much shading...

I certainly don't mind them trying though, if only to keep the games "in print" so to speak, as long as the original versions are accessible as well. And remastered or not I'd re-buy them all on Steam or GOG just because.

I was going to bring it up before, but got sidetracked, but I kind of agree. More than a lot of other games, I somehow feel like the chunky pixels really work for Full Throttle. Particularly in the cutscenes, they kind of feel like part of the style that it would be a shame to lose, though I certainly wouldn't mind seeing how someone would make them high-res.

It feels like you could make The Dig higher res without losing any of the style, say. I mean, they clearly would have rendered the cutscenes higher rez if they could. I even feel like DOTT, it has such a classic cartoon look to it that it seems like it could be reworked into something higher res. But I don't know, it just feels like a higher res FT would lose something important in the translation, when put into motion.

It's difficult to know whether that's just the nostalgia talking, but I don't quite feel that way about the other old LucasArts games, so I don't think it is.

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