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Jethro

The 1.0 Release: Lack of Communication and Disappointment

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The pressure OP refers too came directly from the lack of communication from the team. We were applying pressure to simply get some information out of them as half the time it seem like they were on holiday. Monthly updates would be nice but information buys patience if the dev seems conscientious.

Anyway the damage is done now, you would expect when they say 1.0 in a month they would post a full feature list. I'm guessing they're just embarrassed to do so.

I don't have a very long list of developers I'm no longer willing to support, but it looks like DF are going to have to be one now. They're so uncommunicative I can't even tell if they're nice guys are areseholes yet.

On the plus side this gives me more time to spend on the GalCiv3 forums, where the devs reply daily to peoples posts. 5 Man team I believe (though I could be wrong) with weekly live steams from the devs answering questions and taking suggestions in real time, its inspiring to see the difference.

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We’ll be releasing the game’s full Lua source code a short time after 1.0, which will allow the community to create potentially far-ranging mods that add content
.... I CAN'T PROGRAM! HOW THE **** SHOULD I MAKE MODS FOR THIS GAME? Besides this: Releasing the full code means that EVERYONE WHO PAYED FOR THIS GAME HAS PAYED FOR SOMETHING THAT WILL NOW BE AVAILABLE FOR FREE AND WASTED HIS MONEY!!!

Releasing the Lua codes doesn't mean that you get the whole game for free you idiot. Stop whining about things you don't have a clue about.

Get some manners if you want to prove yourself smarter xD You are maybe right about the code, but you just proved yourself to be what you called me.

I might have no manner, but at least I'm not flipping out, shouting on the internet, making up shit while I'm crying about the game.

You are writing that Double Fine is lying to you, that LeBreton shouldn't fear DF, and tell us the real reason behind this move. And he is probably handled worse than us costumers. What are you talking about? What do you expect? That DF comes out in a statement and says "sorry, whe are in a very difficult financial positions and have to cut some features, and release the game" Because that is the truth, everybody should see that. But no company will make a statement like this. And believe me, Breton is not hurt at DF, he probably knows the positions the company is in, and understands what must be done. There are devs in the industry, whose project is cancelled before release, so I think Breton can live with this decision.

Its an insult to everyone who bought the game and supported it, its an insult to our intelligence to make it that its complete and its an insult to any other developer out there who will now struggle to get funding because of shady tactics like this cash grab.

How do you know that it was a cash grab? What makes you think that they did this on purpose as some sort of plot to steal your money and run away with it while cackling and twisting their mustaches?

You have no idea what happened. You're just angry and saying hurtful things because you are angry on the internet.

Well they decided to cancel the development without telling us a proper reason and this smells like money stuff to me. Emjay may be angry, but his point is right as long as nobody proves the opposite...

See, you talk stupid things like this again. What is DF, the mafia, they steal the customers money and run away with it? I think if that was the case, they wouldn't have spent monts and millions of dollars in a project, before running away with the money, don't you think?
You implied that they spent millions on this project when it's already been proven that others have spent less money and made better, and even completed the same projects.

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You implied that they spent millions on this project when it's already been proven that others have spent less money and made better, and even completed the same projects.

What can I say? DF is bad at managing money, that is obvious now. But don't compare a 2 person developer with DF, they have differenct cost requirements. Still, they used up their money, and they certainly didn't make this game just to get players out of their money.

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@Dr.ROBOTUSSIN: Others who pay their employees a regular salary with which they can live well in San Francisco and take care of their families?

Double Fine didn't run away with the money. Probably they've spent all the money they made with the game on the game.

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We’ll of course be sticking around a bit for bug fixing and support, but any new content for the game will now be in your hands.

That's what I would call "pulling the plug".

I'm fucking over this! I didn't pay these money to let some fan make content, I paid for a professional team that creates content, if this is really where this is going. I'm going to DEMAND the money back! ...

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@Dr.ROBOTUSSIN: Others who pay their employees a regular salary with which they can live well in San Francisco and take care of their families?

Double Fine didn't run away with the money. Probably they've spent all the money they made with the game on the game.

considering what Double Fine has put out recently I am skeptical, plus his managment with money is way to retarded for any regular person to just brush it off and go "OH YOU!". He knows where he lives and how much it costs yet he hasn't seem to come to the realization yet that what he is spending is to big, to much, or a complete waste. For a indie dev he really can not have a company his size and frankly his games are nowhere near making enough to support their size nor are they really showing the quality of a company that is as big as theirs either.

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I might have no manner, but at least I'm not flipping out, shouting on the internet, making up shit while I'm crying about the game.

You are writing that Double Fine is lying to you, that LeBreton shouldn't fear DF, and tell us the real reason behind this move. And he is probably handled worse than us costumers. What are you talking about? What do you expect? That DF comes out in a statement and says "sorry, whe are in a very difficult financial positions and have to cut some features, and release the game" Because that is the truth, everybody should see that. But no company will make a statement like this. And believe me, Breton is not hurt at DF, he probably knows the positions the company is in, and understands what must be done. There are devs in the industry, whose project is cancelled before release, so I think Breton can live with this decision.

Just to make this clear: Writting in bigger letters and in red colour isn't shouting, it is just marking an important spot to me.... And I am not crying, I am complaining about not getting what was planned to be in the game and what I payed for. Besides that: Yes, I want to get a "sorry"-statement.

Its an insult to everyone who bought the game and supported it, its an insult to our intelligence to make it that its complete and its an insult to any other developer out there who will now struggle to get funding because of shady tactics like this cash grab.

How do you know that it was a cash grab? What makes you think that they did this on purpose as some sort of plot to steal your money and run away with it while cackling and twisting their mustaches?

You have no idea what happened. You're just angry and saying hurtful things because you are angry on the internet.

Well they decided to cancel the development without telling us a proper reason and this smells like money stuff to me. Emjay may be angry, but his point is right as long as nobody proves the opposite...

See, you talk stupid things like this again. What is DF, the mafia, they steal the customers money and run away with it? I think if that was the case, they wouldn't have spent monts and millions of dollars in a project, before running away with the money, don't you think?

No. But they probably decided to cancel the project with a small profit instead of using up the resources. And they haven't spend millions of dollars, believe me... there are just four developers... Nevertheless: If you don't spend all the money you get from the backers for the development of the game then you probably wouldn't like to tell them.... would you? So it is a possibility.

Since you call me an "idiot", "stupid" and whatever else, I assume that you are less than 16 years old. At least I hope so for the people around you. I am here to discuss with people, emotions are okay, insults are not. I will use the ignore function for you know. Grow up, please.

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I'm not here to say DF betrayed anyone or that they broke promises.

This game is just not full enough. All the content has one or two layers at best. There are similar games from last decade on GOG for ten bucks that have 10 times the content. No more features but lots more content would probably have satisfied me. It's as simple as this. I won't recommend it to anyone, not out of spit but because it's just too thin, too easy to max out the game's potential in a few hours.

That said, it doesn't encourage me to continue backing double fine. This will be a sub standard offering as it stands and I don't really want to support that kind of game development. I'd love to be proven wrong...

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I'm fucking over this! I didn't pay these money to let some fan make content, I paid for a professional team that creates content, if this is really where this is going. I'm going to DEMAND the money back! ...

Money they probably already spent on developing the game? Well okay then, good luck with that...

Just to make this clear: Writting in bigger letters and in red colour isn't shouting, it is just marking an important spot to me....

It is shouting in text form, it reads like shouting. It's annoying. Cursive or bold text is enough to highlight an important point.

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Since you call me an "idiot", "stupid" and whatever else, I assume that you are less than 16 years old. At least I hope so for the people around you. I am here to discuss with people, emotions are okay, insults are not. I will use the ignore function for you know. Grow up, please.

No, I'm actually turning 31 in december. I just usually move in circles where we don't babysit crybaby gamers of today if they moan and cry over something. And believe me, I've been nice to you. To bad you ignored me and run away from the argument.

Aaaanyho...if people watched the Broken Age documentary, they can see that DF is not in a good shape financially. There is no denying that they have management problems. I believe they wanted to make a great sim with Spacebase, but unfortunately if they ran out of money for this project, there is not much you can do. I don't believe for a second that they just wanted to scam people out of their money, and anyone who follows this company for a long time probably agrees with me. That's just tough luck on the business side. No money, no development.

@Dr.ROBOTUSSIN: Others who pay their employees a regular salary with which they can live well in San Francisco and take care of their families?

Double Fine didn't run away with the money. Probably they've spent all the money they made with the game on the game.

considering what Double Fine has put out recently I am skeptical, plus his managment with money is way to retarded for any regular person to just brush it off and go "OH YOU!". He knows where he lives and how much it costs yet he hasn't seem to come to the realization yet that what he is spending is to big, to much, or a complete waste. For a indie dev he really can not have a company his size and frankly his games are nowhere near making enough to support their size nor are they really showing the quality of a company that is as big as theirs either.
But this is just it. They had the money with the intention of creating the game, but unfortunately they have management problems and ran out of funds. What you say is true, Tim should reasses the situation of the company and make changes if necessary. They are either too big, or living in an expensive enviroment.

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NOOOO.... My powers are dwindling!! We need more hate.

Anyway what is Spacebase about? I got here from a Reddit thread.

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He is talking stupid things? Then maybe you are talking stupid things too From where do you know about the "millions of dollars" spent into spacebase? And do you know how much money the earned with the early access of spacebase?

All we know is that few week ago we got the information that developement is continuing as we know...and now we are near to the end.

Btw, we get the lua-code of the game to be able to mod the game – You have to be very naive if you think they do this only for us, they are not anymore interessted and so the try to push of the work to the community.

I just said a number. Fine, they didn't spend millions of dollars on it. Maybe they just spent a couple 100K on it, but it doesn't change the fact that the invested time and money, built a game, why would they do this if they just wanted to scam the people? They could have made so much less with Spacebase, and they still got the money.

And believe me, I know that they only gave out the Lua codes so the community can develop the game instead of them.

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It has to be said though that a source code release isn't the norm even for Early Access games whose final release doesn't hold up to expectations. And independently of what their intentions with the source code release is, it's cool it's happening. It would be more cool if they continued developing the game, of course. :/

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ShadowBroker, Steam says up front that these games are early access, and some may not get finished.

from http://store.steampowered.com/earlyaccessfaq/

When will these games release?

Its up to the developer to determine when they are ready to 'release'. Some developers have a concrete deadline in mind, while others will get a better sense as the development of the game progresses. You should be aware that some teams will be unable to 'finish' their game. So you should only buy an Early Access game if you are excited about playing it in its current state.

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He is talking stupid things? Then maybe you are talking stupid things too From where do you know about the "millions of dollars" spent into spacebase? And do you know how much money the earned with the early access of spacebase?

All we know is that few week ago we got the information that developement is continuing as we know...and now we are near to the end.

Btw, we get the lua-code of the game to be able to mod the game – You have to be very naive if you think they do this only for us, they are not anymore interessted and so the try to push of the work to the community.

I just said a number. Fine, they didn't spend millions of dollars on it. Maybe they just spent a couple 100K on it, but it doesn't change the fact that the invested time and money, built a game, why would they do this if they just wanted to scam the people? They could have made so much less with Spacebase, and they still got the money.

And believe me, I know that they only gave out the Lua codes so the community can develop the game instead of them.

So, now i hope that the quoting works... :D

Yes, but if they made a win with this "strategy" they betrayed us, their customers, and so i don't see any reason to find good words for that.

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ShadowBroker, Steam says up front that these games are as the name says early access, and some may not get finished.

from http://store.steampowered.com/earlyaccessfaq/

When will these games release?

Its up to the developer to determine when they are ready to 'release'. Some developers have a concrete deadline in mind, while others will get a better sense as the development of the game progresses. You should be aware that some teams will be unable to 'finish' their game. So you should only buy an Early Access game if you are excited about playing it in its current state.

That doesn't mean that you can't be disappointed about how the developers communicate with the people who invest into them and give them their trust. And while you maybe don't expect for a game to finish at any time you can maybe expect that there are at least certain promised/planned feature in it. :)

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ShadowBroker, Steam says up front that these games are early access, and some may not get finished.

from http://store.steampowered.com/earlyaccessfaq/

When will these games release?

Its up to the developer to determine when they are ready to 'release'. Some developers have a concrete deadline in mind, while others will get a better sense as the development of the game progresses. You should be aware that some teams will be unable to 'finish' their game. So you should only buy an Early Access game if you are excited about playing it in its current state.

Maybe he bought the game from the official homepage?

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I'm way behind on this thing...

Listen, I realize that emotions are running high over this announcement but please refrain from personal insults and do try to keep discussion in this thread civil.

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I'm way behind on this thing...

Listen, I realize that emotions are running high over this announcement but please refrain from personal insults and do try to keep discussion in this thread civil.

I love your profil picture, just saying.

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See the homepage.

There will be one last content update, otherwise merely bug fixes.

Anyway, I want to let you all know that I just bought Hack 'n' Slash out of spite. Because I'm a freaking idiot. I hope you're happy now...

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See the homepage.

There will be one last content update, otherwise merely bug fixes.

Anyway, I want to let you all know that I just bought Hack 'n' Slash out of spite. Because I'm a freaking idiot. I hope you're happy now...

Brofist!

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For the price charged its ridiculous.

For the lack of content its ridiculous.

For the promise that they would not 'grab the cash and run' its ridiculous.

For basically making a source code and calling it a game its ridiculous.

For stringing people along all this time with the hopes of a good game with lots of nice features, its ridiculous.

Overall Double Fine have single handedly alienated a portion of their previous fanbase. I say previous because im sure a lot of people will now remember DF as 'the company that shafted people over false claims of what would be'.

They failed to stand up to their initial pitch and since then it got worse and worse, they responded positively saying that they will improve and they would never do a cash grab followed almost immediately by doing a u-turn and grabbing said cash and running.

Ill never invest in a DB early access/Kickstarter project again and quite possibly any project of theirs for that matter. Its a complete smack in the face for those supporting them and its downright disgraceful that they can't even be bothered to give a proper reason for it.

Even a newbie in game development would know that a game simply doesn't go from alpha stage to finished. Its a cash grab and thats it.

Its like someone ordering a takeaway and then only being given a quarter of it because the chef decided it was finished. In that scenario you bet you would be calling up and complaining and getting a refund. Unfortunately in the gaming industry we as consumers are 'allowed' to get shafted by these companies. Its criminal.

P.S. Here's my prediction that Tim will now be known as Tim Shafter...

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Its like someone ordering a takeaway and then only being given a quarter of it because the chef decided it was finished. In that scenario you bet you would be calling up and complaining and getting a refund. Unfortunately in the gaming industry we as consumers are 'allowed' to get shafted by these companies. Its criminal.

I think it's more like going to a fancy restaurant and expecting a full seven course meal, but getting served four or five dishes. But then the chef says "Hey, if you're more hungry you're welcome to whip yourself up something back here in the kitchen."

That said, you're of course entitled to be disappointed. It didn't turn out how you wanted it to, but ultimately that's the risk of Early Access. It's not a safe bet and you should only buy if you feel like you want to get behind and support development of the game. It will always be cheaper and less risky to wait.

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I like the early access program, but depending on what ultimately comes in version 1.0, it will have a significant impact on my decisions to buy into early access or any title related to double fine in the future.

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Double Fine still sucks at communication. They aren't the masters of the message they're trying to get out. The announcement of the 1.0 plan tries to sell something as a good thing that is obviously to everyone a disappointment, therefore emotionally it doesn't sound convincing. They communicate too little. They often express themselves in an unclear, easily misunderstood manner. It's frustrating. :/

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I really liked Hack 'n' Slash and I'm happy I got it during Early Access to support development of it. Spacebase DF-9 isn't really my kind of game, but I figure it's a kind of game that has a lot more unmanageable scope. Too bad many of you feel like you aren't getting what you hoped for though.

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