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matthansen

Day of the Tentacle: Special Edition Wish List Features

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... maybe make it a bit more obvious that after a point you can just drag an item onto a character's portrait to send it to them instead of having to visit the John-o-tron every time, seems fine enough.

Chrono-john, it's a time toilet :)

It's been years since I played, more than a decade, I got confused!

Nevertheless, I look forward to it!

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The absolute most important thing is retaining the chuck jones style of the graphics. I really loved dott's homage to the old shorts and I'd hate to see that lost. It's been a shame in recent years to see classic games sloppily upres'd with filters that lose all the character of the originals(eg Simon the Sorcerer for mobile).

Audio wise it'd be nice to be able to switch back to the original soundtrack - MT-32 for preference. Maybe it could be captured from source if emulating it on the fly is an issue due to the possible need for licensing the use of roland roms?

iMUSE. Was the imuse in mi2:se perfect? I remember a lot of complaints about the console versions, but I never played the game through since I wasn't a fan of the new graphical style or voices (I love Armato but for me he doesn't fit the tone of the first two games). but yeah, perfect imuse would be awesome

Original 9 verb bar as a control option - I haven't really been sold on any of the new point & click control systems used for tales or the special editions to be honest.

As an earlier poster suggested, being able to chose between mm and original dott on weird ed's computer would be awesome

Dave Grossman/Tim Schafer/Ron Gilbert/Gary Winnick commentary. For the commentary, would it be possible to have a kind of video mode - so you just start it and someone's playing the game with the commentary on top as the game is played, kind of like the one tim did here, but with the screen solely fixed on the game, just like a movie commentary :

(And where is part 2? :P)

As has been said, playing a game through with commentary is often a tricky thing - I want to play without the first time, but I don't want to replay the game straight away, but when I come back to it months or years later....I just want to play the game. Would be nice to just listen through the commentary (with the video for context of what's being discussed) without having to do anything.

Good luck with the development!

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iMUSE. Was the imuse in mi2:se perfect? I remember a lot of complaints about the console versions, but I never played the game through since I wasn't a fan of the new graphical style or voices (I love Armato but for me he doesn't fit the tone of the first two games). but yeah, perfect imuse would be awesome

Most of the issues with iMUSE in MI2 were caused by bugs which were fixed in a subsequent patch. Right now it works pretty well - not perfect, but much better than I honestly thought they'd achieve. iMUSE in DOTT is a bit less complex in how its used than MI2, so I think they should be able to do a pretty good implementation of the music, especially if they are using some of the same tech from the singapore implementation.

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Most of the issues with iMUSE in MI2 were caused by bugs which were fixed in a subsequent patch. Right now it works pretty well - not perfect, but much better than I honestly thought they'd achieve. iMUSE in DOTT is a bit less complex in how its used than MI2, so I think they should be able to do a pretty good implementation of the music, especially if they are using some of the same tech from the singapore implementation.

What things didn't they achieve with the MI:SE? I have to say that I thought it was more or less perfect... but I probably missed things.

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Most of the issues with iMUSE in MI2 were caused by bugs which were fixed in a subsequent patch. Right now it works pretty well - not perfect, but much better than I honestly thought they'd achieve. iMUSE in DOTT is a bit less complex in how its used than MI2, so I think they should be able to do a pretty good implementation of the music, especially if they are using some of the same tech from the singapore implementation.

What things didn't they achieve with the MI:SE? I have to say that I thought it was more or less perfect... but I probably missed things.

Off the top of my head, I think they made woodtick work but they didn't replicate the same number of transitional sections, there were a couple of missed cues, and certain cutscenes where the soundtrack didn't quite flow as intended. The lechuck's beard reveal scene at the end of part 1 sticks out to me as one where they didn't quite cue things up right. Minor things, really.

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Oh, I feel like this might have been mentioned already, but I hope it's possible to retain the Max cameo. I never understood why the Monkey Island SEs had to replace them - surely it's possible to get Steve Purcell to give permission to have them reappear in these Special Editions without giving his rights away or anything? Hopefully Tim or someone can give him a call and sort it out...

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Steve would possibly (and perhaps, fairly) want remuneration for his inclusion -- especially how LucasArts treated the last Sam & Max game (the one that got cancelled at the 11 hour). From Disney's point of view how much of the budget should be spent on one line of dialogue that most players wouldn't miss? :-/

I hope it's included, but... I guess there's a good reason it hasn't happened in the past.

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Would be cool if they kept the Max cameo. :)

On a similar note, I was thinking about other possible LucasArts cameos. There are a couple of skulls in the game (the most prominent one being the picture on Hoagie's t-shirt, but there's also that skull with the cigar and fez in their apartment). Maybe they could make one of them look like Murray? Or even Manny?

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I just discovered this thread and I really don't wanna go through 10 pages of posts right now so just tell me if this some of this has been talked about before:

First of all, have you planned anything regarding translations and dubs in different languages?

Because the german translation and voice acting for Day of the Tentacle are HORRIBLE! There are translation mistakes everywhere (pretty bad ones too), the voice actors are pretty bad and they constantly misemphasize sentences.

Personally I'd play the game in english anyway but if you plan to translate it then for the love of god, please don't use the original german translation!

Secondly, when I played Monkey Island 2 Special Edition I noticed a few things that I really didn't like about the new version which should be considered in this remake:

1. Some animations like Guybrush's walk cycles are really smooth and look great but then other animations are still as choppy as they were in the original which is a shame. So please keep the animations consistent. Either make them all smooth or make them all choppy.

2. TIMING!

The timing in the cutscenes is off and the music doesn't synch up with the action anymore. In the original version the music and the animations would work together during the cutscenes. Like for example, when Guybrush steps on the gardener's rake and falls down, the last note of the song (which is kinda like a ...like a "wham" in musical form) would play right as he hits the ground. In the special edition his falling animation comes waaaay too late.

And then in the dream sequence when LeChuck arrives Guybrush turns around way too early, is looking at him as he approaches and only when LeChuck say "boo" does Guybrush get scared even though he has been looking at him for a few seconds and then the part where LeChuck sprays him with the root beer plays out way too quickly so the music can't catch up. Then after that the background stays red until Guybrush says "what a dream" and then it fades back to normal instead of turning back immediately as he wakes up.

It's little details like that that may seem insignificant but they really make a huge difference.

And that's really something that needs to be done right in the Dott SE.

So yeah, in short: Musical timing! Do it right! :D

3. DON'T remove the opening credits the way MI2 SE did. Seriously, what was up with that? Did they think gamers today were too impatient for intro credits? Or did they just run out of time to put them in?

It would be awesome if the shaking effect of Green Tentacle's stereo could synch up with the audio so that it's not just random shaking but shaking to the rhythm of the bass line.

That's all I can think of for now. ^^

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It would be awesome if the shaking effect of Green Tentacle's stereo could synch up with the audio so that it's not just random shaking but shaking to the rhythm of the bass line.

Ooh, I like that!

I'm really looking forward to hearing the SE version of Green's music.

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Secondly, when I played Monkey Island 2 Special Edition I noticed a few things that I really didn't like about the new version which should be considered in this remake:

1. Some animations like Guybrush's walk cycles are really smooth and look great but then other animations are still as choppy as they were in the original which is a shame. So please keep the animations consistent. Either make them all smooth or make them all choppy.

2. TIMING!

The timing in the cutscenes is off and the music doesn't synch up with the action anymore. In the original version the music and the animations would work together during the cutscenes. Like for example, when Guybrush steps on the gardener's rake and falls down, the last note of the song (which is kinda like a ...like a "wham" in musical form) would play right as he hits the ground. In the special edition his falling animation comes waaaay too late.

And then in the dream sequence when LeChuck arrives Guybrush turns around way too early, is looking at him as he approaches and only when LeChuck say "boo" does Guybrush get scared even though he has been looking at him for a few seconds and then the part where LeChuck sprays him with the root beer plays out way too quickly so the music can't catch up. Then after that the background stays red until Guybrush says "what a dream" and then it fades back to normal instead of turning back immediately as he wakes up.

It's little details like that that may seem insignificant but they really make a huge difference.

And that's really something that needs to be done right in the Dott SE.

So yeah, in short: Musical timing! Do it right! :D

3. DON'T remove the opening credits the way MI2 SE did. Seriously, what was up with that? Did they think gamers today were too impatient for intro credits? Or did they just run out of time to put them in?

It would be awesome if the shaking effect of Green Tentacle's stereo could synch up with the audio so that it's not just random shaking but shaking to the rhythm of the bass line.

That's all I can think of for now. ^^

An excellent list! I forgot about the lack of opening credits for the MI2:SE. What WAS that about?

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An excellent list! I forgot about the lack of opening credits for the MI2:SE. What WAS that about?

No idea. At least they still have the music on the title screen. But seriously, if they thought it was too long for a young, impatient audience they could've just made it skippable.

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Hmm...

How about an achievement for squirting every character with the disappearing ink?

:D

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Hmm...

How about an achievement for squirting every character with the disappearing ink?

:D

I second that! :D

Oh oh oh! And for reading the boring book to everybody! :D

And one for trying to stab the cigar salesman as bernard. ^^

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Yes, yes, yes!

I think this game could be a "funny achievements" goldmine. So many great opportunities.

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Hmm...

How about an achievement for squirting every character with the disappearing ink?

:D

I second that! :D

Oh oh oh! And for reading the boring book to everybody! :D

And one for trying to stab the cigar salesman as bernard. ^^

Good ideas. I hope we see them.

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To be completely honest, i wasn't too happy with the Grim Fandango remastered version.

I bought it, yes - i played it, yes. But it didn't feel like a big improvement to the old version playable on ResidualVM.

Realtime shadows and overhauled character models are nice, but that alone didn't cut it for me (new music was great though).

Switching back and forth between the original and remastered version sometimes didn't even change much on the screen.

I know, keeping the original feel to it was an important thing, but you guys got so many incredible artists working at Double Fine. Why not use them to create something fresh while keeping an original touch?

DOTT is probably my favorite game of all time. But if a new version by the original creators isn't much more than port that's playable on new systems with some minor graphical improvements, i'd probably rather stick with my ScummVM version than pay 15$ for it.

I'm not here to give you shit - i bought and loved almost every game you made so far.

It's just my personal opinion.

That being said and since this is a DOTT thread: here's my wish list for DOTT remastered:

* make it 1080p (4:3 looks so 1990)

* new hand-drawn backgrounds and character sprites

* animations in the original are perfect to me

* re-recorded music (maybe live? - at least not the old Midi)

Looking forward to hear what you guys think!

best,

R.

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But it didn't feel like a big improvement to the old version playable on ResidualVM.

My guess is that's what the "remastered" title was meant to indicate - my understanding is that it was a preservation effort more than an attempt to make the game feel more modern or at home on more modern systems.

To me, the biggest and most significant thing that Grim Remastered brought was putting the game back "in print" for the first time in many years - being able to play it with ResidualVM doesn't mean much to anybody who doesn't already have the game, right?

I think that we're going to see much more significant changes for DoTT's Special Edition :)

The animations are going to be an interesting thing to tackle. I suspect that the team may want to pursue higher frame rate animations, and if they do, then that opens up a bunch of room for interpretation (just like with low res images, our minds fill in the blanks for low frame rate animations, meaning that a lot of it ends up existing in our imaginations).

I'm pretty sure the Monkey 1 special edition kept the original frame count for animations - does anybody recall whether the Monkey 2 special edition did? I have a nagging feeling that it had higher frame rate animations (and I couldn't be bothered firing it up in Wine to check >_<).

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But it didn't feel like a big improvement to the old version playable on ResidualVM.

My guess is that's what the "remastered" title was meant to indicate - my understanding is that it was a preservation effort more than an attempt to make the game feel more modern or at home on more modern systems.

To me, the biggest and most significant thing that Grim Remastered brought was putting the game back "in print" for the first time in many years - being able to play it with ResidualVM doesn't mean much to anybody who doesn't already have the game, right?

I think that we're going to see much more significant changes for DoTT's Special Edition :)

The animations are going to be an interesting thing to tackle. I suspect that the team may want to pursue higher frame rate animations, and if they do, then that opens up a bunch of room for interpretation (just like with low res images, our minds fill in the blanks for low frame rate animations, meaning that a lot of it ends up existing in our imaginations).

I'm pretty sure the Monkey 1 special edition kept the original frame count for animations - does anybody recall whether the Monkey 2 special edition did? I have a nagging feeling that it had higher frame rate animations (and I couldn't be bothered firing it up in Wine to check >_<).

MI 2 SE managed a higher frame rate for animations like the walk animation which definitely made walking around feel much better. I suspect that it'll be less of an issue for DOTT because the characters are less detailed, more cartoon, and you can get away with lower framerates in that style without it looking like a paper cut out, and some of the animations are pretty high number of frames in the first place, and will probably translate to high res better than MI1/2 where, for example, reaching upwards was a single frame of animation.

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Thanks for your answers.

For me the term "Remastered" is more of a technical and visual improvement than bringing something back in print.

If I buy an old movie on BluRay it's (if it's done properly) rescanned from the original analogue tapes and -remastered- to increase the quality and bring it up to new standards. Even modern CGI is added in the case of the Star Wars movies (like it or not :-))

Maybe I'd wish for a DOTT "remake" (if it's all about the term definition).

If you take a look at Leisure Suit Larry: Reloaded, MI2 or MI2, they all look nice and re-done for the modern times.

As a player of the classics I'm looking for a new way to experience my favorite games.

If I'm a new player, i kinda expect some visual quality to a released product.

I saw a lot of comments on Steam about Grim where people give advice to get the original on Ebay and play it with Residual.

Even though I love that Double Fine brings back old Adventure games, i would probably follow their advice if remastererd-DOTT's purpose is to bring the old game it back in print.

Anyway!

We could talk about that for ages and we won't know until first screenshots pop up :-)

I hope for the best!

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Even modern CGI is added in the case of the Star Wars movies (like it or not :-))

Actually, that was done for the Special Editions, not the earlier remastered versions.

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I'm pretty sure the Monkey 1 special edition kept the original frame count for animations - does anybody recall whether the Monkey 2 special edition did? I have a nagging feeling that it had higher frame rate animations (and I couldn't be bothered firing it up in Wine to check >_<).

The thing about Monkey 2 SE...

Like KestrelPi already said some animation are really smooth and looked fantastic. But what I don't like is that it's so very inconsistent. Most of the other animations look REALLY choppy in comparison. I think they should've either made them all equally smooth or equally choppy.

I hope you guys keep it consistent in the DoTT SE.

I also agree that DoTT's animations already have a pretty good framerate.

Also look at these close-ups:

gfs_51526_1_11.jpg

dotss2.gif

beauty.jpg

7573-maniac-mansion-day-of-the-tentacle-dos-screenshot-the-edisonss.gif

I don't think you need to add more detail to their sprites than these close-ups have.

What I also noticed is that these close-ups have a bit of shading, while the normal sprites don't. Maybe you could add some shading to the remastered sprites if they look too barren by themselves? Just a thought.

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I suspect that it'll be less of an issue for DOTT because the characters are less detailed, more cartoon, and you can get away with lower framerates in that style without it looking like a paper cut out

Thanks for the Monkey 2 clarification. It's definitely possible that they'll stick with low frame rate animations! It'll be interesting to see where things go :)

For me the term "Remastered" is more of a technical and visual improvement than bringing something back in print.

Oh, I agree, but I feel that that stuff was covered by having things render at a higher resolution (which is the equivalent of rescanning/mastering original film, whilst increasing model resolution might be more like re-shooting stuff), new lighting and re-recorded score.

Me saying that being "in print" again is the most significant benefit wasn't related to whether Grim should've been called a "remastered" edition or a "special edition" - I just think that that's the most important thing for that game at this time :)

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The animations are going to be an interesting thing to tackle. I suspect that the team may want to pursue higher frame rate animations, and if they do, then that opens up a bunch of room for interpretation (just like with low res images, our minds fill in the blanks for low frame rate animations, meaning that a lot of it ends up existing in our imaginations).
I hope the higher frame rate is the 24 FPS that cartoons use, and not a higher one that would make the animations feel more "twined" than "full animation".
What I also noticed is that these close-ups have a bit of shading, while the normal sprites don't. Maybe you could add some shading to the remastered sprites if they look too barren by themselves? Just a thought.
It makes sense that only those have shading because it adds to the mood of those certain scenes.

It's a wrong assumption for cartoons to think that "if it's HD, shading should be added everywhere because it will look more realistic". You can check how many 90s cartoons like Ren & Stimpy never used any shading for their characters even on close-ups, except for very specific scenes that needed them. Still happens on series like Spongebob, for example.

That said, it would be neat if any added shades on the characters were context sensitive and only appeared on dimly lit rooms, etc.

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]I hope the higher frame rate is the 24 FPS that cartoons use
Actually most animated TV shows were animated on 2s (which means half the actual frame rate), whereas animating on 1s is mostly restricted to animated feature films. So I think animating at 12 fps (or more monitor friendly 15 fps) would be more than enough for DOTT.

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]I hope the higher frame rate is the 24 FPS that cartoons use
Actually most animated TV shows were animated on 2s (which means half the actual frame rate), whereas animating on 1s is mostly restricted to animated feature films. So I think animating at 12 fps (or more monitor friendly 15 fps) would be more than enough for DOTT.

This is totally true. In fact, since the art style in the game is mimicking Chuck Jones' shorts, running at a solid 12 fps would be often be overkill. Holding poses for several frames is a trademark of Jones' work. It's one of the big things that makes his shorts look different than Freleng's or McKimson's.

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15fps would probably be fine.

Sometimes, it's worth animating at 24fps, even if the majority of each sequence is on twos. If you get a short action that needs to happen really quickly, it's nice to have the option to use 24fps just for that part.

BTW, is 60 (and numbers that 60 can be divided by) a standard frame rate for games nowadays? I've only been involved in making freeware games before so I don't have much in the way of professional knowledge, but that's what I've been told. In a little game I'm animating for at the moment, I've been asked to do everything at 20fps (so naturally most of the action happens at 10fps).

Just thought I'd mention it because working at this frame rate has been going well for me, and it's almost as high a frame rate as that used in traditional TV cartoons. But like I said, I don't know if that is a standard thing for lots of companies or just what one developer has decided to tell me!

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Yeah, frame rates that go into 60 evenly are standard for games, as most monitors have a refresh rate of 60 hertz. There are a lot of games that use the full 60, but there's still a lot of games that are 30FPS as well. Games that run at lower than 30FPS aren't as common, but they're out there.

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Yeah, frame rates that go into 60 evenly are standard for games, as most monitors have a refresh rate of 60 hertz. There are a lot of games that use the full 60, but there's still a lot of games that are 30FPS as well. Games that run at lower than 30FPS aren't as common, but they're out there.

Minesweeper 2015 - now running at 60 fps!

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Yeah, frame rates that go into 60 evenly are standard for games, as most monitors have a refresh rate of 60 hertz. There are a lot of games that use the full 60, but there's still a lot of games that are 30FPS as well. Games that run at lower than 30FPS aren't as common, but they're out there.

That makes sense. Thanks for clearing that up!

Ah, Minesweeper 2015. Minimum requirements include 8 gig RAM and quad core.

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