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I enjoyed reading The Magicians, and recommended it to Dashing, who read through it and was like "wow, you like furry porn?"

I totally did not process the bit where they turn into foxes and have sex.

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1 hour ago, Alcoremortis said:

I enjoyed reading The Magicians, and recommended it to Dashing, who read through it and was like "wow, you like furry porn?"

I totally did not process the bit where they turn into foxes and have sex.

Haha, a friend of mine recommended it to me and I made furry porn jokes to him as well.

That part didn't actually bother me too much, even though it was a little bit... strange. haha.

But I just felt like he treated all of the women in that book like sex toys. Not that they had no character, but it was sort of like the weird efforts of a kinda misogynist dude attempting to write good female characters without realizing the problems with how he is treating them? I actually really enjoyed the magicians in MOST ways and think Grossman is a really talented author who also does really great characters. I only had two major criticisms with that book:

1) His constantly referencing other works of fiction. It has a tendency to either break the suspension of disbelief or else make an otherwise decent book feel more like an internet fan fiction than it deserves. I suppose that's not a problem if you're an avid consumer of fan fiction, but I am not, so this was problematic for me.

2) Absolutely immature sex. I don't have a problem with sex at all, as long as it is reasonable and tasteful. But Grossman is so absurdly gratuitous with the way he tosses out sexual content that it just comes across as puerile. It didn't bother me at first, cuz sometimes people have sex in books, and I'm down with that, but as the book went on and he tossed out more and more of these absolutely meaningless and unnecessary little gratuitous sexual things I just got annoyed. Like the part where the main character is talking to his girlfriend's mom and for no reason he looks down and her nipple pops out and he looks at it and kinda likes it. Why? Why does this happen? It means nothing. It serves no purpose. It's just like "Here's a female character. Think I'd like to see this one's tits now" and then it happens. Or like that one part with the giant troll or whatever, and he keeps going on and on about how it's naked and you can see its huge d**k swinging back and forth like a giant pendulum. Why? Who cares? What purpose does this serve? It's just CONSTANT with crap like this and it made me so frustrated because he's obviously talented but his puerile horniness just made me want to grab his stupid head and shake some sense into him. It's not that I find it offensive; it's that I find it childish. It just came off as an extremely talented writer who needs to grow the hell up.

SIGH.

Obviously it didn't bother a lot of people.

But, like or dislike Rothfuss, I do agree with one thing he said once in an interview, which was basically this (paraphrasing from memory): "I didn't like a lot of the fantasy I was reading. The more of it I read, and I read A LOT of it, the more it all started to sound the same. Yadda yadda hero, magic, maybe some dragons, some kind of war, some ancient evil, etcetera etcetera. It started to feel like if you've read one you've read them all. So I thought, if the kind of fantasy story I want to read the most doesn't exist, then I guess I'll just have to try and write it."

Amen to that. :tup:

Edited by AnAnemoneInAnonymity

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13 minutes ago, Scarecrow said:

He's certainly no Grignr, that's for sure.

Can I buy a vowel?

Also, the only way to read that is with a fanfic representation of MST3K: http://www.bmsc.washington.edu/people/merritt/books/Eye_of_Argon.html

8 minutes ago, AnAnemoneInAnonymity said:

Haha, a friend of mine recommended it to me and I made furry porn jokes to him as well.

That part didn't actually bother me to much, even though it was a little bit... weird. haha.

But I just felt like he treated all of the women in that book like sex toys. Not that they had no character, but it was sort of like the weird efforts of a kinda misogynist dude attempting to write good female characters without realizing the problems with how he is treating them? I actually really enjoyed the magicians in MOST ways and think Grossman is a really talented author who also does really great characters. I only had two major criticisms with that book:

1) His constantly referencing other works of fiction has a tendency to either break the suspension of the belief or else make an otherwise decent book feel more like an internet fan fiction than it deserves. I suppose that's not a problem if you're an avid consumer of fan fiction, but I am not, so this was problematic for me.

2) Absolutely immature sex. I don't have a problem with sex at all, as long as it is reasonable and tasteful. But Grossman is so absurdly gratuitous with the way he tosses out sexual content that it just comes across as puerile. It didn't bother me at first, cuz sometimes people have sex in books, and I'm down with that, but as the book went on and he tossed out more and more of these absolutely meaningless and unnecessary little gratuitous sexual things I just got annoyed. Like the part where the main character is talking to his girlfriend's mom and for no reason he looks down and her nipple pops out and he looks at it and kinda likes it. Why? Why does this happen? It means nothing. It serves no purpose. It's just like "Here's a female character. Think I'd like to see this one's tits now" and then it happens. Or like that one part with the giant troll or whatever, and he keeps going on and on about how it's naked and you can see its huge d**k swinging back and forth like a giant pendulum. Why? Who cares? What purpose does this serve? It's just CONSTANT with crap like this and it made me so frustrated because he's obviously talented but his puerile horniness just made me want to grab his stupid head and shake some sense into him. It's not that I find it offensive; it's that I find it childish. It just came off as an extremely talented writer who needs to grow the hell up.

SIGH.

Obviously it didn't bother a lot of people.

But, like or dislike Rothfuss, I do agree with one thing he said once in an interview, which was basically this (paraphrasing from memory): "I didn't like a lot of the fiction I was reading. The more of it I read, and I read A LOT of it, the more it all started to sound the same. Yadda yadda hero, magic, maybe some dragons, some kind of war, some ancient evil, etcetera etcetera. It started to feel like if you've read one you've read them all. So I thought, if the kind of fantasy story I want to read the most doesn't exist, then I guess I'll just have to try and write it."

Amen to that. :tup:

The second book, I felt, was a lot better in this regard since Quentin kinda takes a backseat as a character and the story focuses more on Julia. Though there was a disturbing rape scene near the end, again with a fox (seriously, what is with this guy and foxes?). However, I got the feeling that he was purposefully pulling out all the stops on how disturbing the scene was specifically to make a point about awful the evil the characters had just unleashed into the world was. I haven't read the third one yet, so I dunno where it all goes, but I from wikipedia, it looks like she gets to murder that fox in the end, so I guess that's something.

Edited by Alcoremortis

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38 minutes ago, Alcoremortis said:

Can I buy a vowel?

Also, the only way to read that is with a fanfic representation of MST3K: http://www.bmsc.washington.edu/people/merritt/books/Eye_of_Argon.html

The second book, I felt, was a lot better in this regard since Quentin kinda takes a backseat as a character and the story focuses more on Julia. Though there was a disturbing rape scene near the end, again with a fox (seriously, what is with this guy and foxes?). However, I got the feeling that he was purposefully pulling out all the stops on how disturbing the scene was specifically to make a point about awful the evil the characters had just unleashed into the world was. I haven't read the third one yet, so I dunno where it all goes, but I from wikipedia, it looks like she gets to murder that fox in the end, so I guess that's something.

Hmm.. maybe. Gotta be honest, though, that hearing that already turns me off a little. Male authors who want their female characters to have a terrible backstory or to be traumatized seem to always, always, always go immediately to making them a victim of sexual violence. (I'm looking at you, too, VIDEO GAMES.) Like there is no other terrible thing that can happen to a woman or traumatize a woman or make her want vengeance.

Nope. Gotta rape her. Kinda doesn't surprise me to hear he wrote in a rape.

Edited by AnAnemoneInAnonymity

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Seasonal Reminder: Do not donate to Salvation Army bell ringers.

Your money will go to an organization that actively works to erode LGTB and human rights. Donate to your local food pantry, or planned parenthood, or some other group that supports causes you believe in, but do not give to bell ringers.

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1 minute ago, AnAnemoneInAnonymity said:

Hmm.. maybe. Gotta be honest, though, that hearing that already turns me off a little. Male authors who want their female characters to have a terrible backstory or to be traumatized seem to always, always, always go immediately to making them a victim of sexual violence. (I'm looking at you, too, VIDEO GAMES.) Like there is no other terrible thing that can happen to a woman or traumatize a woman or make her want vengeance.

Nope. Gotta rape her. Kinda doesn't surprise me to hear he did a rape.

Part of me was disappointed he went that way, though given roughly half of the story was dedicated to her and this crazy out of control summoning spell turned mass murder/rape it felt less cheap than the vast majority of rape backstories.

But yeah, I know that I personally would never write in a female rape backstory just because it's done so often that it doesn't really feel like there's anything non-depressing to say about it. I probably wouldn't even write a male rape one, though I might gesture vaguely at it if it fit the character's mannerisms.

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3 minutes ago, Alcoremortis said:

Part of me was disappointed he went that way, though given roughly half of the story was dedicated to her and this crazy out of control summoning spell turned mass murder/rape it felt less cheap than the vast majority of rape backstories.

But yeah, I know that I personally would never write in a female rape backstory just because it's done so often that it doesn't really feel like there's anything non-depressing to say about it. I probably wouldn't even write a male rape one, though I might gesture vaguely at it if it fit the character's mannerisms.

At this point, the use of rape to garner sympathy for a female character to me is kinda like beginning a story with the protagonist waking up or opening their eyes.

It's not NECESSARILY a bad idea. It could POSSIBLY work. But chances are it would be better if you didn't.

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6 hours ago, Scarecrow said:

Unfortunately rape as backstory or as character developing trauma is common enough at this point to be considered cliche.

Yes, that is what I have been saying.

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10 hours ago, AnAnemoneInAnonymity said:

I have a few friends who felt the same way about it, but we can't all like everything equally. I am bored to TEEEARS by Robert Jordan---a confession that is nigh scandalous to my fellow nerds. But I'm happy to say it and watch them squirm. :overlord:

I really enjoy the Name Of The Wind books (I call them that because it's a good name and "Kingkiller Chronicles" is a stupid name) because I think Rothfuss spins a really good character-driven story. I try out a lot of fantasy but to me the characters are usually very bland and the stories are so overly obsessed with wanking to the descriptions of dragons and magic and unicorns etc that they forget to actually make the characters someone I could love or hate or feel any genuine feelings about whatsoever. If it's just some unicorns and dragons and then several things happen one after the other, then sure, some things happen, and it was fantasy, but I don't care at all. I used to hate quitting books, but I'm to the point now where if I'm a certain % through the book and I still don't care, then I just move on.

Anyway, all of that being said, and while I do find Rothfuss one of the better sci-fi/fantasy authors for strong characters, I also agree with you that one of the greatest weaknesses of the story is that Kvothe is kind of a douche. In a lot of ways he acts like a douche, but also there is something kinda douchey about him on a meta-level. It's one thing to have a protagonist who is "the one" when it comes to a certain thing. Like Luke Skywalker is "the one" with the force, or Lyra is "the one" when it comes to being the rare human who can use and read an alethiometer, miscellaneous zombie stories have "the one" who is immune to zombie-ism (I also count you in that category, Dragon Age Origins). But Kvothe is sort of a masturbatory protagonist in a lot of ways. Like you can imagine a twelve year old Rothfuss sitting at a keyboard typing

AND AND AND HE IS THE BEST AT THE RAREST AND MOST POWERFUL MAGIC

AND HE IS THE BEST AT PLAYING GUITAR

AND THE MOST BEAUTIFUL GIRL IN THE LAND WANTS HIM

BUT IT'S TOO COMPLICATED, SO HE JUST F***S AROUND INSTEAD, LIKE A DIFF GIRL EVERY NIGHT

HE F***S TWO TWIN SISTER NINJAS AT THE SAME TIME

THEN A DIVINELY BEAUTIFUL SEX GODDESS OF ANCIENT LEGEND WHO STEALS MEN AWAY INTO THE FEY AND THEN MURDERS THEM CAPTURES KVOTHE AND TAKES HIM TO THE FEY, BUT HE IS SO STUDLY AND SINGS AND PLAYS GUITAR SO GOOD, HE F***S HER FOR FIFTY PAGES AND THEN SHE LETS HIM GO BECAUSE HE IS THE BEST AT SEX SHE HAS EVER HAD AND SHE HAS EXISTED SINCE THE BEGINNING OF TIME THAT IS HOW GOOD KVOTHE IS

AND ALSO HE IS REALLY NICE (JUST IGNORE THAT HE IS A F***BOY)

etc etc

I totally get that criticism and it is 100% fair. Still, he is not the worst offender in that department. Don't even get me started on Lev Grossman's The Magicians and the sexuality in that book. Ugh. I could rant and rant and rant.

blah blah blah yadda yadda long anemone post etc etc

Curious to see where this tv/movie stuff goes!

I love WoT but it's more about the experience than Jordan being a pageturner author.

I agree, the sex goddess being the worst of it. I kind of imagine that Rothfuss feels like he made a character that he can get away with being so perfect because of the 'adversity' that he goes through. But part of the problem is that it's like made-up plot devices where everything turns against the character who always has good intentions and talent in order to keep it interesting. If he's going to be good at everything then he should have some more significant personal failings or regrettable decisions to make him relate able.

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1 hour ago, Brütal Ke$ha said:

I love WoT but it's more about the experience than Jordan being a pageturner author.

I agree, the sex goddess being the worst of it. I kind of imagine that Rothfuss feels like he made a character that he can get away with being so perfect because of the 'adversity' that he goes through. But part of the problem is that it's like made-up plot devices where everything turns against the character who always has good intentions and talent in order to keep it interesting. If he's going to be good at everything then he should have some more significant personal failings or regrettable decisions to make him relate able.

Nor sure what WoT being "about the experience" means. Isn't all media about the experience? I tried to get into them, read I think about 3 books in, and they were... okay.... but I had no strong desire to finish that series and was in fact eager to move on.

I think that is a fair criticism of Kvothe as well but I don't think the problem is necessarily that Kvothe never does anything wrong. There are plenty of stories where the hero/protagonist is just a good person that terrible shit happens to. The problem is that Kvothe isn't just a good person but otherwise kinda average schlub being tested to his limit. The problem is that Rothfuss gives Kvothe EVERYTHING.

Like you can have a character who is unfailingly good, but the drawback is that they have less power because they are just kind of an average schlub. So it is interesting when they are tested. Like when the ordinary wal-mart cashier or whatever has to save a bunch of people from zombies and, son of a %#$@&!, he actually does it in spite of his apparent ordinariness. As an audience we kinda love that. Because we feel like WE are ordinary, so it's like, hey maybe I am a secret hero in spite of my ordinariness too!

 

Or you can have a character that is super powerful, super talented, really just the best. But the drawback is that they are not the best AS A PERSON. They make mistakes, they have vices, violent tempers, something like that. As an audience we like that because it's like, wow, this person seemed like a god among mortals, but they are just flawed, like me.

 

The problem is that Rothfuss wants Kvothe to have the best of both of these worlds, so Kvothe can unfortunately seem like just a vessel for Rothfuss’s secret wish fulfillment, which is only a stone’s throw away from being Mary Sue.

 

There is a lot to like about the books as well. I am especially fond of the Auri stuff, for example. But the books are not without weak points, definitely.

Edited by AnAnemoneInAnonymity

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Some criticisms of Harry Potter / JK Rowling are that HP is too perfect, is given everything, and yet Rowling wants us to believe he is just a poor kid that keeps getting shat on.

But he is a celebrity at school, is the captain of the sports ball team, is a trust fund rich kid with a billion dollars in the bank, is a constant teacher's pet (ignoring snape), and constantly breaks rules all the time and gets away with it BECAUSE OF WHO HE IS.

As many have pointed out, the books want us to view Harry as a poor dweeb always getting shat on and bullied, but he's actually kind of a rich kid jock if you think about it.

So Rothfuss is not alone in writing popular books about a borderline Mary Sue character who has it all but pretends to not have it all.

The difference, perhaps, is that Harry is sometimes a stupid arsehole you'd like to smack. So the HP starts with him as the ordinary-schlub-becomes-hero type and then transitions him into a flawed god type.

Kvothe is sorta like "I'm great all the time but nobody understands me" =(

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33 minutes ago, AnAnemoneInAnonymity said:

Some criticisms of Harry Potter / JK Rowling are that HP is too perfect, is given everything, and yet Rowling wants us to believe he is just a poor kid that keeps getting shat on.

But he is a celebrity at school, is the captain of the sports ball team, is a trust fund rich kid with a billion dollars in the bank, is a constant teacher's pet (ignoring snape), and constantly breaks rules all the time and gets away with it BECAUSE OF WHO HE IS.

As many have pointed out, the books want us to view Harry as a poor dweeb always getting shat on and bullied, but he's actually kind of a rich kid jock if you think about it.

So Rothfuss is not alone in writing popular books about a borderline Mary Sue character who has it all but pretends to not have it all.

The difference, perhaps, is that Harry is sometimes a stupid arsehole you'd like to smack. So the HP starts with him as the ordinary-schlub-becomes-hero type and then transitions him into a flawed god type.

Kvothe is sorta like "I'm great all the time but nobody understands me" =(

I don't think she really portrayed him as a "poor kid" after he established himself at Hogwarts. He definitely was a poor kid when living with his step parents, to a comical degree. He was then a kid with very few friends and no family, nowhere to go during the holidays, and with average academic results. (With a few exceptions.) He was good looking, was good at sports, and many of the other kids found him interesting. But he was also harassed by the parallel group to Hitler youth (the Malfoy gang), betrayed and injured by crazy adults several times, and having to deal with very complicated issues despite being a child.

He was not very sympathetic in books five through seven, even though he wanted to be, and his money didn't really improve his life that much. I would say he is a classic example of being a lonely child of rich parents - parents who were also dead.

He was introverted, frustrating to deal with at times, and sometimes very angry. But he was still mostly humble, probably because of his bad childhood, and he managed to be nice to people most of the time, despite not feeling so good about himself and his situation.

Edited by fargetv

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49 minutes ago, fargetv said:

I don't think she really portrayed him as a "poor kid" after he established himself at Hogwarts. He definitely was a poor kid when living with his step parents, to a comical degree. He was then a kid with very few friends and no family, nowhere to go during the holidays, and with average academic results. (With a few exceptions.) He was good looking, was good at sports, and many of the other kids found him interesting. But he was also harassed by the parallel group to Hitler youth (the Malfoy gang), betrayed and injured by crazy adults several times, and having to deal with very complicated issues despite being a child.

He was not very sympathetic in books five through seven, even though he wanted to be, and his money didn't really improve his life that much. I would say he is a classic example of being a lonely child of rich parents - parents who were also dead.

He was introverted, frustrating to deal with at times, and sometimes very angry. But he was still mostly humble, probably because of his bad childhood, and he managed to be nice to people most of the time, despite not feeling so good about himself and his situation.

Yep. I may have been unclear, but the point I was raising is that, yes, in a lot of ways HP was "given it all" but manages to be complex and avoid coming off as a bit of a Mary Sue in spite of  technically "having it all" in a lot of respects.

Kvothe is a very similar character archetype to HP (indeed Rothfuss's series is like an alt universe Harry Potter almost) , but Kvothe doesn't strike that balance quite as well as HP and Rothfuss's protagonist leans a little closer to Mary Sue than HP does as a result.

S'all I meant.

Edited by AnAnemoneInAnonymity

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Sigh, the next fight is going to be Deadpool vs. Pinkie Pie, isn't it?

Edited by epic

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11 hours ago, AnAnemoneInAnonymity said:

Nor sure what WoT being "about the experience" means. Isn't all media about the experience? I tried to get into them, read I think about 3 books in, and they were... okay.... but I had no strong desire to finish that series and was in fact eager to move on.

I think that is a fair criticism of Kvothe as well but I don't think the problem is necessarily that Kvothe never does anything wrong. There are plenty of stories where the hero/protagonist is just a good person that terrible shit happens to. The problem is that Kvothe isn't just a good person but otherwise kinda average schlub being tested to his limit. The problem is that Rothfuss gives Kvothe EVERYTHING.

Like you can have a character who is unfailingly good, but the drawback is that they have less power because they are just kind of an average schlub. So it is interesting when they are tested. Like when the ordinary wal-mart cashier or whatever has to save a bunch of people from zombies and, son of a %#$@&!, he actually does it in spite of his apparent ordinariness. As an audience we kinda love that. Because we feel like WE are ordinary, so it's like, hey maybe I am a secret hero in spite of my ordinariness too!

 

Or you can have a character that is super powerful, super talented, really just the best. But the drawback is that they are not the best AS A PERSON. They make mistakes, they have vices, violent tempers, something like that. As an audience we like that because it's like, wow, this person seemed like a god among mortals, but they are just flawed, like me.

 

The problem is that Rothfuss wants Kvothe to have the best of both of these worlds, so Kvothe can unfortunately seem like just a vessel for Rothfuss’s secret wish fulfillment, which is only a stone’s throw away from being Mary Sue.

 

There is a lot to like about the books as well. I am especially fond of the Auri stuff, for example. But the books are not without weak points, definitely.

I guess what I mean by the experience is that what makes it neat is seeing the character development over several hundred hours of being invested. It was really well built up over time, it was sort of arduous but it actually felt like it was a multi-year campaign against evil where a bunch of characters grow into adults.

What I was getting at with Kvothe being a uncorrupt morally was, like you talked about, in tandem with him being too talented. It's just something that might've made him a more interesting character given his talents.

Have you read the spin-off novel about Auri?

9 hours ago, epic said:

Sigh, the next fight is going to be Deadpool vs. Pinkie Pie, isn't it?

I arrived at a similar conclusion before I watched the video. Zoro's fight against Pika was pretty monstrous and he hasn't really looked like he's tried hard since the time-skip. Since I don't read the manga I don't know what Erza looks like since the timeskip but it might be a more interesting comparison come the spring when the show shows her in a serious fight again.

Also I could do without the stupid voices. And the english voice-actors, so glad I watched both shows with subs.

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I never did attempt an avatar.  I opted to watch hockey and drink enough to be ill for 2 days after.  Not a good time.

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Ever get that feeling in the past 3 years that you just can't keep up?

It's because you can't.

38.png

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Hah! Interesting. The most suprising information for me is the difference between 2013 and 2014. What happened? Unity?

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2 hours ago, fargetv said:

Hah! Interesting. The most suprising information for me is the difference between 2013 and 2014. What happened? Unity?

I"m guessing it had more to do with changes made in 2012 and the huge results just didn't start showing up until 2013-2014. Changes included:

--introduction of Greenlight (and making Steam more open in general)

--Big Picture mode

--Steam mobile app released

--Steam now allows non-game software

All of that happened in 2012, so I'm guessing all of that together was a lot of the bump.

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Red Dead Redemption now available on PC! =D

But only via playstation streaming service. T_T

*cursing under breath*
*grabs coat and leaves*
*slams the door*

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I'm having a tough time right now and I don't know if I should be sharing this or even if anyone cares but I might as well try.

I've been with my girlfriend for a little over a year and a half and it's never been easy what with her ex, health problems and not living near each other usually meant we only saw each other about about once or twice a month. I'll admit it was tough but there was always hope for the future, at least that's what we talked about with the plan that I could move in with her once I finished my undergraduate degree, which I did in the summer, especially as I was thinking about doing post graduate study nearer where she lives. So I applied for the masters course and got accepted in September and we had planned that I would move in October but a serious diagnosis (don't want to go into detail here) first delayed and eventually stopped this plan mainly because her kids (from previous relationship) were having problems (understandably) and the daughter that was going to move out so I could move in didn't (it was not 100% necessary but it also kinda was). So I ended up moving into student accommodation at my uni with bit of help financially from her. But now I haven't heard from her in nearly two weeks with the last message I got saying that she was in hospital. At the time it wasn't that surprising and I expected not to hear from her for a few days but there's been nothing since that message and all ways I've tried to get hold of her have failed. I've even tried reaching out to her daughter on facebook (who is the only other family member that I've met and that was only briefly) but have had no response so far and I don't think I'll get one either. I'm kind of freaking out a bit here, as I've no idea what is going on or where she is or what to do or anything.

I don't expect anyone can actually help, expect for the people involved but I just needed to get it off my chest for a little bit. Sorry for the downer, you can get back to the normal nonsense now.

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1 hour ago, CorruptBiggins said:

I'm having a tough time right now and I don't know if I should be sharing this or even if anyone cares but I might as well try.

I've been with my girlfriend for a little over a year and a half and it's never been easy what with her ex, health problems and not living near each other usually meant we only saw each other about about once or twice a month. I'll admit it was tough but there was always hope for the future, at least that's what we talked about with the plan that I could move in with her once I finished my undergraduate degree, which I did in the summer, especially as I was thinking about doing post graduate study nearer where she lives. So I applied for the masters course and got accepted in September and we had planned that I would move in October but a serious diagnosis (don't want to go into detail here) first delayed and eventually stopped this plan mainly because her kids (from previous relationship) were having problems (understandably) and the daughter that was going to move out so I could move in didn't (it was not 100% necessary but it also kinda was). So I ended up moving into student accommodation at my uni with bit of help financially from her. But now I haven't heard from her in nearly two weeks with the last message I got saying that she was in hospital. At the time it wasn't that surprising and I expected not to hear from her for a few days but there's been nothing since that message and all ways I've tried to get hold of her have failed. I've even tried reaching out to her daughter on facebook (who is the only other family member that I've met and that was only briefly) but have had no response so far and I don't think I'll get one either. I'm kind of freaking out a bit here, as I've no idea what is going on or where she is or what to do or anything.

I don't expect anyone can actually help, expect for the people involved but I just needed to get it off my chest for a little bit. Sorry for the downer, you can get back to the normal nonsense now.

Not much an internet stranger can say. Hope she's okay, hope there is an explanation soon, and hope you're gonna be okay, too. :tup:

Edited by AnAnemoneInAnonymity

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