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Just so long as you solemnly swear that us original backers will always have a special place in your heart!

Say it - or NO DEAL!

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If you want to keep the respect of your 87,000 backers, this is what should be done (in my opinion).

I understand people have various opinions but could you please stop generalising? 87000 backers loosing respect? Please...

Believe me, not everyone will react as you. Just scan this thread and you will see very little disappointment.

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If you want to keep the respect of your 87,000 backers, this is what should be done (in my opinion).

I understand people have various opinions but could you please stop generalising? 87000 backers loosing respect? Please...

Believe me, not everyone will react as you. Just scan this thread and you will see very little disappointment.

+1

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I agree.

I think the game quality will benefit about this, and the "exclusive feeling" to be a backer it's not that important!

However, these "15$ preorder guys" should not have more stuff than who plaged 15$ as backer to be fair.

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I'm with the minority in having mixed feelings about this, thinking it sort of undermines the Kickstarter thing -- but I doubt a statistically relevant number of people will even notice that you're doing it.

I guess this is a confirmation, of sorts, that the game will retail at $15?

I'd always imagined that it'd be higher ($24.99 or $19.99 at least), but we'd benefited from getting in early. I definitely donated more due to the limited time frame, and wanting to improve the project (not get the rewards). I think putting an actual price tag on being a backer ($15) is a lot different from the open "donate what you can" thing. It certainly changes the fundraising telethon tone of things slightly.

On the other hand, I'm all for more people being interested in adventure games, and you making money off the game. It's still not clear whether this is money being added to the project's budget and scope, or simply the beginning of income and profits from the project (but it seems likely it's the later, since you've already budgeted stuff). I guess this doesn't matter, and it's all pretty much the same thing, either way.

I'd feel a bit better if this was a 3-month time-limited thing, or something, for people that genuinely missed the deadline. I think it's a pretty dangerous precedent to set, if a lot of other Kickstarters start doing this -- could really hurt the feeling of urgency and exclusiveness that some projects absolutely depend on to succeed.

I agree with jonathanfrisby that it could ultimately ruin the Kickstarter phenomenon with removing the urgency of a contribution. In that aspect I think you should differentiate the new pre-order just a bit. I would be perfectly happy with it being $16 or at least a limited time-frame for entering the backers forum.

I don't see myself as special in being a backer and I only contributed with $15, but I'm genuinely afraid it would hurt this new kickstarting phenomenon. Go ahead and open the preorders, give access to the backers forum and the early beta, but please just charge a little bit extra (if only $1) or make it different in another way.

I sincerely hope you'll earn millions of dollars on this game and I wish you the best, but please keep ind mind you have a great responsibility in making this kind of funding a success for future games as well.

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I hereby offer my agree, with a dash of squee.

Understanding that I found out about this later into the kickstart cycle and spread the word, I found myself wondering what if I'd have missed out, had I been even busier. I think a developer should be able to extend their kickstart if needs be and having a paypal donate button, especially at the fifteen dollar rate when I'm thinking it may retail at higher, not only lets the developers keep 10% more of every new incoming donation, but it allows more funding to come into the project.

Sadly, not everything in the development cycle can always be accounted for in an exacting fashion. In fact, I am of the mind that - should something happen like a fire that caused double fine to lose some development work - if they later opened a kickstarter extension on the same project, I'd have absolutely no issue. Bring on the new backers, and let them be welcomed with open arms!

My only concern would be from a business perspective. 90,000 is definitely not the full limit of the player base, but the longer the 15 dollar rate stays open, the more likely people are to hop on the bandwagon at that price. Which, if it gets very popular, may diminish profits after release. Still, if I'm worried about an awesome well funded game making only a modest splash instead of a cool mint, I suppose that's a good worry to have. With that said, Double Fine deserves their due, and I will feel most satisfied if I know that the game is not only well funded, in fact not only critically acclaimed, but also that it's making them lots of money too! To an artist, art is milk, art is meat, art is bread.

I wish for them a feast that's been long coming.

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It´s absolut and very important that you alow people that want to get in legaly to pay and be part of this. If you don´t do it there is no argument against piracy. If many people vote for not turning a blind eye on piracy this is the only way.

Also the people that are "against this" need to understand that they are not more special than anybody else is just because they read the right blogs or had a little more extra cash to spare in the right 30 days. It´s crowdfunding. It´s social. So be a social gamer and don´t put up your ego inbetwen all the other awsome backers that understand this. :)

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Hm about the possible damage to final sells question, maybe it could include a TBD discount code for the standard boxed version to force them to spend more at the end (and that could increase the Paypal donations in the short term too).. Obviously the code should be given to the original backers too, that could be problematic for the different amounts pledged etc. (even if the same code for everybody should be ok)

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Good for the budget! Good For the community! Good idea!

Of course I can also see why it would make sense to raise the price a bit. 20 dollars seems still fair and reasonable and it's probably easier to support the idea then (or stay with 15 dollars and don't include them in the beta-testing)... but personally: 15 or 19,90 dollars - I couldn't care less!

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A sale is a sale, I don't see how it would harm the final sales.

It might be better, financially speaking, for DF to sell the game as pre-orders through their website as they won't have to deduct any distribution costs, as Steam etc would.

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I could see a pre-order simply being for the game, but to give away the documentary, the beta access and the forums seems a bit much.

Couldn´t agree more.

Do the preorder (for $ 15), sell the game to benefit the studio, but don´t sell out the Kickstarter idea.

So don´t grant access to any of the backer´s exclusives, like the beta, forums, or video series! The videos will be released to the public later anyway so there is no point in missing out something!

In my humble opinion this topic excludes itself from the normal democratic process of discussion in the forums, it´s more a matter of "contract" or at least "promise" or "trust".

But if you think the other way, why not send a real survey via mail to all backers, like you´ve done with the shirts and credits!

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There's only 2 kinds of people in the world, backers and latecomers,

but it seems to me the party would be less fun without them, so open the gates!

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So don´t grant access to any of the backer´s exclusives, like the beta, forums, or video series! The videos will be released to the public later anyway so there is no point in missing out something!

Couldn't disagree more ;-)

Give the internet an option to get legal access to the videos now instead of just let them get pirated...

Was the "kickstarter idea"(?) also selled out with the 110.000$ extra cash which didn't come through kickstarter?

Edit:

Some nitpicking: The 15$-Tier granted "The finished game in all of its awesome glory DRM free on PC, Mac, and Linux, or via Steam for PC and Mac, exclusive access to the Beta on Steam, access to the video series, and access the private discussion community."

So... maybe everyone (including Etienne) is happy if the 15$-late-backers are getting everything (inlcuding the videos) except the early-backers-exclusive-access to the beta?

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I don't really have any strong opinion either way... More money is a good thing but as said above, it can be seen by some as going against the idea of a kickstarter. Maybe it would be better going with a slightly higher pre order price, like $19.99, or limiting beta/forum access?

I do agree with Etienne though, a survey would be the best way to do this. Of 87k backers only a relatively small group will voice their opinions here on the boards.

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So... maybe everyone (including Etienne) is happy if the 15$-late-backers are getting everything (inlcuding the videos) except the early-backers-exclusive-access to the beta?

There was the word "exclusive" on that one indeed..

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But the later you pre-order the more you know what you are getting, so you have kind of a benefit in that a reason to pre-oder at a later rather than an earlier date, so how about you increase the pre-order price periodically through let's say a logarithmic function?

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I do agree with Etienne though, a survey would be the best way to do this. Of 87k backers only a relatively small group will voice their opinions here on the boards.

With all it's openness and two-sided communication, which I'm certainly looking forward to experience throughout the next year, DF is still a company. This games' development is not a democratic process. OP did state, that they were going to do this but wanted to give us a heads up.

Depending on our feedback we may see some alterations to this plan. Be it a higher fee or some other restrictions. But so far most, in the replies here and the poll, don't seem to mind...

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Couldn't disagree more ;-)

Give the internet an option to get legal access to the videos now instead of just let them get pirated...

And you really consider this to be a valid argument? Piracy? Really? So why not give away all movies & software on the planet for free then, so nothing could possibly be pirated anymore.

[del][/del][del][/del]

[del][/del][del][/del]

Was the "kickstarter idea"(?) also selled out with the 110.000$ extra cash which didn't come through kickstarter?

Nope, imo the idea wasn´t sold out that way, because this was independent money given from third partys at a time, when the Kickstarter campaign was still running, and Tim frankly told us about them (he even told us their names).

[del][/del][del][/del]

[del][/del][del][/del]

Edit:

Some nitpicking: The 15$-Tier granted "The finished game in all of its awesome glory DRM free on PC, Mac, and Linux, or via Steam for PC and Mac, exclusive access to the Beta on Steam, access to the video series, and access the private discussion community."

So... maybe everyone (including Etienne) is happy if the 15$-late-backers are getting everything (inlcuding the videos) except the early-backers-exclusive-access to the beta?

Not so fast, my young Padawan! First allow me to nitpick back a little:

See the initial pitch video (2:35 to 2:39) and listen to Tim´s own words: "[...] exclusive online community of people who funded the game".

Poeple who preorder, do not fund but buy the game, and that´s a different thing in my book.

Overall I think it´s less a matter of being "happy" but more a matter of principle.

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*snip*

At this point a preorder isn't much different than a 15buck pledge in kickstarter. Not enough material has being made public about the game yet, so perhaps there's a small window for new people to get involved.

The piracy element is true. People are going to get access to the videos regardless. Eventually they will be public. So, allowing people to pay for the 'privilege', while there still isn't much going on with them, is alright. I guess the people who pay 15 bucks via this method won't be able to beta test too.

I find it to be a fair deal. This just benefits everyone.

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I do agree with Etienne though, a survey would be the best way to do this. Of 87k backers only a relatively small group will voice their opinions here on the boards.

With all it's openness and two-sided communication, which I'm certainly looking forward to experience throughout the next year, DF is still a company. This games' development is not a democratic process. OP did state, that they were going to do this but wanted to give us a heads up.

Depending on our feedback we may see some alterations to this plan. Be it a higher fee or some other restrictions. But so far most, in the replies here and the poll, don't seem to mind...

Well, like I said, I'm fine either way. I backed this project because I wanted to be a backer, not to be in the "special club for special people". :)

OP did ask for opinions though, and this has more to do with the funding and reward part of the project than the development of the game. Gamers are an opinionated bunch and you can be sure that some will miss this thread and make a stink about it, so maybe it's better to be safe than sorry. ;)

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It's a fair deal. It's not like pre-ording from a brick and mortar store where money goes God knows where. It's going straight to Double Fine, and hence, funding the project. Even pre-orders a month out from release help with ancillary costs, like making sure Tim has plenty of Venti Iced Vanilla Lattes to keep him going. I think Double Fine is doing right by all the people who want to support this project and make it the best game it can possibly be.

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It's not like its a publisher coming in to back it after the kickstarter and taking control of aspects of the game. It's just more folks like us who enjoy adventure games :)

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