Jump to content
Double Fine Action Forums
Sign in to follow this  
Greg Rice

DF Game Club: Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery EP

Recommended Posts

I can't stand Braid because the platforming aspect of the game is overly finicky - all too often in it I can see the solution to a puzzle, and confirm it's the correct solution with a walkthrough, but I can't actually pull it off because I'm not quite good enough at platforming to do it - and because I thought the writing was shallow and dumb in the way only pseudo-deep pseudo-intellectual "look at how clever I am" writing can be; on the other hand, lots of people like it.

Definitely agree on the story aspect, but it seems a bit odd to complain that a platformer required you to be good at platforming. True it is mostly a puzzle game, but I thought it controlled quite well and any platforming challenges were legitimate and not unfair, especially with unlimited ability to rewind and try again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now I'm wondering; is Logfella the kind of hipster lumberjack that will not be in the Double Fine Adventure?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Definitely agree on the story aspect, but it seems a bit odd to complain that a platformer required you to be good at platforming. True it is mostly a puzzle game, but I thought it controlled quite well and any platforming challenges were legitimate and not unfair, especially with unlimited ability to rewind and try again.

Well, that's precisely it. It's both a puzzler and a platformer.

When I play a puzzle-based game I expect to be able to advance once I have worked out the solution to a puzzle.

When I play a platformer I expect to be able to advance if I am good enough at the platforming. Maybe I'm just clumsy but I found a lot of the platforming in Braid ridiculously frustrating, even with rewinds.

When you're both a puzzler and a platformer you're doubling the number of barriers to progress: rather than jump through one hoop, I must jump through two. And when I find I can do one hoop but can't do the second it makes me apocalyptically frustrated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'd like to join in on the club. Can someone tell me where in the game you all check-pointed at so I can try to catch up to it?

So far, we've completed the second session/chapter.

Thank you very much! I'll try to catch up soon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey guys, so we could play on Saturday, BUT I think the next session is actually intended to be played on the dark moon. Has anyone started it up to see if this is the case? There are ways to alter the state of the moon, but it's kind of fun to play alongside the actual moon. If this is indeed the case, I believe the "dark moon" is on Tuesday. It says in the Megatome. Perhaps we should play then instead?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hey guys, so we could play on Saturday, BUT I think the next session is actually intended to be played on the dark moon. Has anyone started it up to see if this is the case? There are ways to alter the state of the moon, but it's kind of fun to play alongside the actual moon. If this is indeed the case, I believe the "dark moon" is on Tuesday. It says in the Megatome. Perhaps we should play then instead?!

I'm fine with that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why not try another game? Doesn't seem a particularly popular choice...

I'd also be fine with that. I have a fairly neutral opinion of S&S so far. The things I like and the things I hate almost perfectly cancel each other out to create an opinion of "Eh, it's okay."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, if you start on the dark moon then you'll have to stop after you did the things in the dream there. Otherwise, if you start on any other day than the dark moon or the bright moon then you find a way to change the moon cycle, I think.

So I don't think you should start the third session on a dark moon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, since you have to go on the New Moon *and* the Full Moon then unless you want to drag this thing out for two weeks longer than planned then sticking to the moon cycle is a REALLY BAD IDEA (please God don't do it).

(Also I thought last time the Megatome said "8 days to the dark moon" - so that'd make it on Sunday.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've actually been playing this game for a while. I just keep missing each time the moon is full, and that, coupled with my desire to beat the game with no time-shifting shenanigans, results in a bundle of empty time. :U

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Island where you have to free yourself From the great sins, in surrealistic settings created by an obsessive calvinistic magician.

Should work well in à story about growing up.

Got The idea From à childrens book The Little Captain by Paul Biegel where there is such an Island.

In it, 4 children make à children's odyssey in à world that feels à lot Like both Monkey Island and Grim Fandango.

ITS about growing Up.

I think Tim should try To get his hands On it and read it, because ITS wonderful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see you're making a habit out of posting in the wrong thread, Drgeert! :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Was hoping for gaming club today. It's almost like tradition already that saturday is DFA gaming day. But no can do :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I gotta agree with jonathanfrisby there that the club seems to be harmed by the fact that there's no certainty about anything. People come by asking if there's going to be a game club, and if it's going to be streamed and all we can say is that we don't know anything for sure..

Either we should stick to a fixed schedule (of course SOME exceptions are fine) and preferably always had some kind of a stream, or there should be a schedule planned in advance where people could check up when it's going to be the next time. Personally I highly prefer the fixed schedule, can easily set up my phone to remind me about the game club a bit in advance..

If you want more people joining for the game club, and thus get more publicity in general, you could try and make this just a bit more professional. For example, you could try and set up a better streaming system so there wouldn't be that many problems with it, get it set up in advance, not once you should start the stream. To get a stream popular, commentary is also pretty much a must have.

You could for example look at how Johnny Phantom does streaming, his adventure game marathons have been really good .. http://www.twitch.tv/johnnyphantom/b/318706810

Also, I'm highly in favor of making the game club a bit more of an event, Greg and Chris Remo could try and talk to some of the game creators (Resonance, The Journey Down, I'm sure tons more would be interested in a bit of free publicity) and get them more deeply in the events. Sort of like when Jane Jensen was there, but more active during the gameplay, not just a short Q&A session before starting the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm definitely in favour of scheduling. We seemed to be informally scheduled on Saturday for a while but then people got all confused as to whether we'd still play on weeks when there wasn't any streaming, and then we've had this latest thing where it's been reschedule literally on the same day or thereabouts as when it was meant to go, which has clearly confused a bunch of people.

(I'd also like to repeat my call from upthread for a poll on whether we want to keep going with Superbrothers at all - again, it sounds like a lot of people just plain don't like it, and I'd like to establish whether we're a vocal minority or an actual majority.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'd also like to repeat my call from upthread for a poll on whether we want to keep going with Superbrothers at all - again, it sounds like a lot of people just plain don't like it, and I'd like to establish whether we're a vocal minority or an actual majority.

Personally I sort of like Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery .. and sort of don't like it .. would say it's ok, but not that great. What's the main issue with it is the fact that it's split into short sessions and Greg has just run through them in ~30min each, making the game club event pretty short. This is especially an issue if we have to change the schedule because a game tells us we shouldn't play it on Saturdays, but instead play it on a schedule it decides..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ That's definitely an issue.

I'll be blunt here, I'm also not happy with the way Greg has handled that particular decision. Declaring that we're going to be playing according to the moon phases rather than using the means built into the game to get around that is kind of bad enough (can't we decide as a community how we're going to tackle that?), but making the declaration so soon before the game club event so as to present us with a fait accompli really rubs me up the wrong way.

I'm kind of angry over here, to be honest. Not as angry as I'd have been if I'd been intending to keep playing the game, mind, but still - not thrilled.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
^ That's definitely an issue.

... but making the declaration so soon before the game club event so as to present us with a fait accompli really rubs me up the wrong way.

I'm kind of angry over here, to be honest. Not as angry as I'd have been if I'd been intending to keep playing the game, mind, but still - not thrilled.

Mjeah, I can understand that completely. I'm not thrilled about it either, but I am sort of sympathetic towards the DF guys. I assume one of the main issues here is that Greg (and possibly Chris Remo) don't really have expertise in running an event like this. Maybe they should team up and try and get the event organized better.

I feel the game club should be/could be/is one of the major community events, and if Chris is supposed to be the community manager, maybe he should try and step up with some sort of a solution here that will please the community? Maybe he could do the commentary, or run the stream when Greg can't?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am appreciative of the effort that Greg has put into the Game Club to this point, considering that it's a completely optional thing which he really didn't have to do at all. It's not like the GC's a Kickstarter reward or anything, it's just a little community-building exercise which has turned out to be awesome and kind of popular.

I'd almost suggest switching to it being a community-organised thing with volunteers taking the lead - someone could sort out a schedule, people could volunteer to stream in a particular week so we're not constantly seeing the same steam, etc. Then again one of the main benefits of the GC has been having us play alongside Greg - not only has it been really good for community building, but I suspect observing our reactions to different stuff in adventure games has been more than a little useful to the DFA team. Handing the organisation over to the community would risk having the DF contribution to the game club atrophy.

Hrm, it's a tough one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I knew I wouldn't be able to play at the same time as everyone else (that was the idea wasn't it or have I missed the point?) and I missed the beginning of the club anyway so I've just been playing it for an hour (or less) each evening (5 evenings in total I think, a couple of the sessions took less than that).

I really enjoyed the game, it's different and interesting. Great music, I don't love the graphics but they add a interesting touch to things. Dialog perhaps tried a little hard at times but overall very good. As someone else said the game is oddly moving at points, I credit the music and sound.

The puzzles were annoying in places, very arbitary and sometimes without any internal logic to guide you to a solution.

On the otherhand I felt it was always fairly obvious that you were meant to interact with with game in different ways using the same mechanisms (e.g. different uses of of sworcery and shield/sword) as there is nothing else to interact with (kind of reminded my a tiny bit if Portal in that way). The inventory is almost non-existant and your ability to interact with the game is limited to these things so, IMO, it seemed obvious that every solution would be based on these mechanisms and experimented with them until I found a solution. All of the solutions are ultimately simple, though not obvious, once you understand thats going to be consistently the case the rest largely falls into place.

Finally, yes the game was frustrating and I got stuck at times but I don't think I was ever stuck for more than 30 minutes (it seemed to me that you can fight the boar on any phase of the moon, though perhaps I got lucky, and get the key to alter the moons phase pretty much straight away). But this is an adventure game, your supposed to get frustrated with them!

When I think back through a lot of older adventure games I can think of some far more annoying and arbitrary puzzles, games I would spend days playing just to solve a single puzzle. Now I'm not suggesting that was a good thing but spending 20-30 minutes solving a puzzle doesn't seem like that big a deal? Or was my experience not typcial timewise?

It does also make me wonder if as gamers we expect to be guided a lot more than we once were? Or is this a generation gap :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

P.S Love the idea of a game club, after finishing a game I'm always desperate to talk to someone about it and the idea of being part of a community that is all playing the same game who you can talk to (and vent off to!) is very appealing. Like a book club but even geekier! Kind of hope this continues past the end of the DF project :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
P.S Love the idea of a game club, after finishing a game I'm always desperate to talk to someone about it and the idea of being part of a community that is all playing the same game who you can talk to (and vent off to!) is very appealing. Like a book club but even geekier! Kind of hope this continues past the end of the DF project :)

as do I, I'm kinda new around these parts too, and hey, I'm actually in the middle of playing this game my self, and according to arch agent dude, is a game best shared... so i guess i'll recount my thoughts on it? i don't know if we're supposed to talk here or what...so...

It looks like most post have been complaints about touch phone controls, but I'll stay out of that since i play on a computer(keyboard attached). I just finish session 3, and didn't have much trouble with the game to this point. the fights aren't so challenging, not a main focus of the game at all- the real appeal seems to be in the land and all this "WE" talk... (intermittent spoilers)

I admit the shield's tri use was a little odd(coulda told me about healing...) but i'm glad i didn't know about it, gave the game a sense of danger since till the dark moon trigon kicked a whole star clean off my HP counter, I never died, and would never have if i was using buttons instead of a trackpad.In fact, i was afraid of Gogolithic Goat face, because i didn't know he took a mortal form to fight- i had seen him spawning on the graves of scythians by the bridge and hightailed it back to the hut to hide in dream world. after i fought the dancing dovah-Bear and got his key, i just waited for the dark moon, thinking that it was triggering Gogolithic goat Mass.... and I was right. at the dark moon, I was able to just waltz up to the grave dudes and hear them out, and THEN Goglithic came at me, and got his head chopped off.

so i've just used the paradox room to do that thing no one is talking about even though the game throws crazy hints at it, and long story short, I am extremely aware that My max HP has dipped... and has been doing so for some time.

no one has any thing to say about that? or the gogolithic's appearances? I don't know about you but this feels like an adventure to me, learning about the game as i played, the environment, the corny self praise the game offers you for being awesome... doesn't it not just feel a little bit epic each session? I was actually a little excited for the dark moon before i realized... you know... I can't see it.

FYI, I did not kill grizzled boor, and am curious to what happens if you kill or never meet him. does he not invite you to the rave?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't been able to follow along with the stream (the one Saturday I was around, it apparently fizzled - it would have been nice to have someone come into the IRC channel and say "You can all go to bed now"), but I am thoroughly enjoying S&S. I'm at 97% at the moment and feel massively invested in the Scythian, and I'm worried about the toll her quest is taking.

I've been a bit surprised by some of the negative comments about the game though, and I hope the Game Club pulls through to the game's conclusion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah, i lost interest in the game when i missed 2 dark moon cycles in a row.

The required "waiting for moons" thing is a double edged sword.

I can see how it works on a iPad but with a PC you have to boot up to play?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░░

▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒

▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒

▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓

▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲

We did not hear from our friend Greg, even though it was that time of the month.

♫♪♫♫♪♪♪♫♫♪♪♪♫♫♪♪♪♫

▼▼▼►

▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲

▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲

▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲▲

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
yeah, i lost interest in the game when i missed 2 dark moon cycles in a row.

It sounds like you haven't yet found one of the nicest locations in the game. I don't know how to make spoiler bars so I won't say any more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am so confused by this game and the moon thing. I just spent ages wandering around aimlessly, kept having to fight that black dudes guys over and over.. Confused.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...