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The Boy Who Suddenly Had Everything...

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The Boy Who Suddenly Had Everything He Ever Wanted: A Cautionary Tale.

Once upon a time, there was a man of great talent and experience in the field of entertainment. His work had enchanted millions, and he was lauded (and rightly so) as a visionary in his field. Eventually, his reputation became such that he was able (with the aid of generous donations from his fans, and those who wished to see more of his work) to step outside of the traditional production sequence, with its inherent shackles and work directly from his artist's heart...to write his own ticket, as the expression goes. After all, given what had come before, it was a sure thing that the result would be astounding, phenomenal, amazing...

...and then he made a movie called Episode I: The Phantom Menace, which (along with its two cohorts) proceeded to crush the hopes and dreams of a generation.

By which all I mean to say is that (while I have no reason to believe that they won't) I hope Tim and Co. recognize the difference between unfettered creative thinking and the wanton dismissal of their audience's expectations. Whether or not they felt hampered by them, I hope the crew remember that their reputation was built within the constraints imposed by the big-studio budget men...and that 'Because We Can' is not really an acceptable reason for doing anything.

Just a thought; delivered in the spirit of friendly advice. A word to the wise, as it were...

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Comparing Tim Scahfer to George Lucas is like comparing apples to a guy who forgot how character and storytelling works.

Tim Schafer is apples.

I like apples.

I'm sure Tim remembers how to tell a story.

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To be fair, I'm not comparing Tim to George...I'm simply holding up Mr. Lucas as an example of how not to react when one finds himself in a situation similar to the one Tim's currently in.

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To be fair, I'm not comparing Tim to George...I'm simply holding up Mr. Lucas as an example of how not to react when one finds himself in a situation similar to the one Tim's currently in.

I think the situations are quite different in a few important ways:

1) Lucas was returning to make prequels to a beloved franchise, Tim is making a brand new game, albeit in the same genre as some of his old games. Expectations are high.... but not in the same way.

2) Lucas had a lot more resources to make the prequels in comparison with what Tim has to make this game. The game budget is over 2 million, which is lovely, but it's still a good small-game budget and they'll have to work in those constraints, whereas Lucas could just rely on spectacle, arguably at the expense of what made the older films good. So I think it's an exaggeration to say Tim now has everything.

3) The source of the money is obviously very different, and that has to inform what you do with it. There's a certain sense of responsibility that comes with the money being directly from fans, specifically for this project.

Also, Tim has said in the past that he's always been able, despite pressures, to pretty much make the game he wanted to make, so I'm not sure that making this game will be so much different, except for being watched by a lot of backers, and except for not having to explain himself to publishers at every turn.

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Well, there was one main difference though...

Georges Lucas used is own money for the production of Ep1, so failure was not an option (and the movie was a huge financial success, so he must have done something right).

Tim Schafer used backers money. So even if the final game sells 10 copies, it won't be a great loss for Double Fine.

Knowing that, I hope that Tim Schafer will disregard audience expectations and create the game he has always dreamed to make. Creating a work of art for what you imagine to be your target audiance is a sure path toward self-parody and mediocrity.

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Knowing that, I hope that Tim Schafer will disregard audience expectations and create the game he has always dreamed to make.

And if he doesn't, then he can always re-release it in 20 years with a whole bunch of extra adventure intserted with CGI.

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How do you know that Tim and Ron's old games wouldn't have been even better without those constraints?

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Creative freedom gave us Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band! It's a good thing!

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Actually no one promised you the game will be great. You were promised that "either the game will be great, or a spectacular failure, caught on camera for everyone to see".

By the way, not really sure what one can do with your statement. You do have a chance to influence if you think the game is going to fail, but you'll need to be more specific. Another by the way, I have only seen things are pointing towards "great".

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I think there's a fair argument that Lucas was never talented and that the original Star Wars films were saved by his team. Here's two links to some amusing videos related to the subject...

http://redlettermedia.com/half-in-the-bag/the-people-vs-george-lucas-and-star-wars-discussion/

http://redlettermedia.com/half-in-the-bag/red-tails/

When I first watched the Red Letter Media reviews (HILARIOUS), I just thought that spinning George that way made for a really good joke... but I don't know... as time goes by and the more rumors I hear about things he wanted to do in the movies and other people corrected him or talked him out of it... eek.

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Creative freedom gave us Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band! It's a good thing!

Well... creative freedom and access to copious quantities and varieties of mind altering drugs...

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George Lucas just isn't a good writer. Once upon a time he collaborated with good writers and made good movies. Then he decided he didn't have to do that anymore and wrote bad movies.

Tim is a good writer. He will write more good things because that's what good writers do.

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George Lucas just isn't a good writer. Once upon a time he collaborated with good writers and made good movies. Then he decided he didn't have to do that anymore and wrote bad movies.

Tim is a good writer. He will write more good things because that's what good writers do.

I think also Lucas has lost the ability to recognise good writing. I remember some story about how there was an Indy IV script all ready to go that Spielberg was totally happy with, but Lucas vetoed it and we ended up with the Indy IV we know... which... I don't think was as bad as a lot of people say, but it also wasn't GREAT, and most of that was nothing to do with the plot and everything to do with the lacklustre script.

He's too confident in his own judgement, and as we've seen, Tim is always willing to look to others for guidance - that's a strength.

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Lucas wrote the new Star Wars movies for his kids, Tims is writing for us, the backers and the audience with similiar taste as the backers.

And if there had been a @grumpymoviemaker next to Lucas, then there sure as h*ll wouldn´t have been a Jar Jar Binks.

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I think the big difference between Schafer and Lucas is that one of them is still the proud owner of a soul.

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I think the big difference between Schafer and Lucas is that one of them is still the proud owner of a soul.
And a neck. That isn't pregnant.

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I think the big difference between Schafer and Lucas is that one of them is still the proud owner of a soul.

Not that I´m that fond of the new SW movies, but such comments is a bit too hateful for this forum I think. Ease up a bit, it´s only movies.

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Actually no one promised you the game will be great. You were promised that "either the game will be great, or a spectacular failure, caught on camera for everyone to see".

I'd probably be happy with either outcome.

It's become evident that this whole thing's about the journey.

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I think the big difference between Schafer and Lucas is that one of them is still the proud owner of a soul.

Not that I´m that fond of the new SW movies, but such comments is a bit too hateful for this forum I think. Ease up a bit, it´s only movies.

I think all he means is that Brother George needs a little more soul! Pappa needs a brand new bag! It's a man's world! Wooo! Come on!

*dancing*

James-Brown-9228350-1-402.jpg

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Personally I think that complete creative freedom is not a signpost for failure.

There have been many games, which were produced that way that were awesome

(Shadow of the Colossus, Super Mario Galaxy or Portal 2 come to mind).

While admittedly there were also big failures in that regard

(like Duke Nukem Forever or Metroid: Other M).

So there is potential for both.

Though I'd argue that selective memory simply makes these failures stand out,

while the sucesses are simply remembered as being good,

disregarding the huge budgets and complete creative freedom that made them possible.

But as others have pointed out, Tim is not really in the same position. He is working in a niche genre,

that is kind of restrictive in of itself already. And the 3 Mil. dollar budget still pales in comparison to other titles.

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You know, I think most of the hating towards the newest Star Wars exist because people expected too much. Even the best Star Wars are not masterpieces. People expected masterpieces. Yeah, the new ones are worse (except the III, IMO), the only thing I'm trying to say is that they're not such a disaster. Even I and II.

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I actually think that the prequels are more interesting than the original trilogy, but saying that usually gets me a lot of hate.

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It is clear that some people missed the main point of what I was trying to say, which was as follows:

1. Stay true to yourself; don't let it go to your head.

and

2. Don't go hog-wild just because there's not a Big Brother to say you can't.

At this point, I would like to emphasize the parenthetical comment in the OP where I point out that I don't necessarily believe that either of these things is taking place. OTOH, I think they're both fair points and (even if I exaggerate in making them) worth mentioning. If somebody at Double Fine thinks about what I said for 10 seconds, I'll be perfectly satisfied. If they don't...no harm done, as far as I'm concerned.

Regards,

-ZZ

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It is clear that some people missed the main point of what I was trying to say, which was as follows:

1. Stay true to yourself; don't let it go to your head.

and

2. Don't go hog-wild just because there's not a Big Brother to say you can't.

At this point, I would like to emphasize the parenthetical comment in the OP where I point out that I don't necessarily believe that either of these things is taking place. OTOH, I think they're both fair points and (even if I exaggerate in making them) worth mentioning. If somebody at Double Fine thinks about what I said for 10 seconds, I'll be perfectly satisfied. If they don't...no harm done, as far as I'm concerned.

Regards,

-ZZ

I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Maybe if this is a message to DF just email/PM them and we can close this thread.

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It is clear that some people missed the main point of what I was trying to say, which was as follows:

1. Stay true to yourself; don't let it go to your head.

and

2. Don't go hog-wild just because there's not a Big Brother to say you can't.

At this point, I would like to emphasize the parenthetical comment in the OP where I point out that I don't necessarily believe that either of these things is taking place. OTOH, I think they're both fair points and (even if I exaggerate in making them) worth mentioning. If somebody at Double Fine thinks about what I said for 10 seconds, I'll be perfectly satisfied. If they don't...no harm done, as far as I'm concerned.

Regards,

-ZZ

I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Maybe if this is a message to DF just email/PM them and we can close this thread.

I think he's saying 'Here's something to think about, but it's not really what I actually think, so either take these points on board or don't'. It's like, for example, if I gave you a fish and said 'here, hold this' and you were all 'hey, is this fish for me to eat, or...?' and I just waved my arms mysteriously, backing off into the distance with a meaningful glare.

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I think he's saying 'Here's something to think about, but it's not really what I actually think, so either take these points on board or don't'. It's like, for example, if I gave you a fish and said 'here, hold this' and you were all 'hey, is this fish for me to eat, or...?' and I just waved my arms mysteriously, backing off into the distance with a meaningful glare.

I agree. This thread feels so unmanaged, if only we had someone to manage it...

Until then, due to SurplusGamer's analogy and lack of anything meaningful to say here, I'll remind everyone of the backers' fish thread.

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I'd like to take this opportunity to remind you that Tim Schafer is not a cod.

(ah... remember the good old days of the forum's golden age?)

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Well... creative freedom and access to copious quantities and varieties of...

Ah yes. And we all know the secret ingredient in Double Fine's "free soda"...

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