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Tim Schafer

Art Update 7: Searching for Sacrifice Girl

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I definitely like the profile of C the most. In all the other ones she looks like an ant.

Of course, if she IS an ant or other ant-like creature, then you have really nailed it with all of them! Great job!

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I do have this slight worry that if we're paid too much attention to in this type of scenario, that might actually not be a super good thing, though. I mean, I like really bold designs in games, which is why I really loved how stuff looks in Psychonauts, Grim Fandango, and so on. Is there a risk that by getting everyone's opinion, what we're ending up with is a sort of group opinion which consists of what is the safest option, rather than a bold design that might not immediately be most peoples' favourite, but is ultimately more interesting to work with? Just an idle musing.

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I like A for her pose. Sacrifice girl is different than the rest of the villagers who have submitted to the rule of the horrible monster. She volunteered for this and she has been receiving training by a noble centaur who live in a cave in the mountains. And she is ready :blank:

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I'm definitely in favor of L, Circle N, and O. L had the best feel for body and dress, but Circle N had the cool head, and bits of O just worked. Choices are hard!

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I like O for the way she is proudly facing straight ahead. Tim may like poses, but this is no poser, she is the real deal!

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I do have this slight worry that if we're paid too much attention to in this type of scenario, that might actually not be a super good thing, though. I mean, I like really bold designs in games, which is why I really loved how stuff looks in Psychonauts, Grim Fandango, and so on. Is there a risk that by getting everyone's opinion, what we're ending up with is a sort of group opinion which consists of what is the safest option, rather than a bold design that might not immediately be most peoples' favourite, but is ultimately more interesting to work with? Just an idle musing.
I guess we don't know. This is a really strange situation where you get input from the fanbase before the game is put out or even tested... or even made.

Perhaps this will only help us (the fans) get a better result.

But that's a darn good question you're asking.

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Alright! Well it's awesome to see these budding ideas as they're happening, especially from Senor Campbell. I really enjoy the general shape of her all throughout these gestures, and I think that she would look great with a kind of native american vibe. The choice to have her modeled in the spirit of Miyazaki is of course fantastic, and I'm all for it. She should move around like Princess Mononoke. I can very much see this model jumping around tree tops and just having a general sense of acrobatics in the way she moves around. There could be a joke in there too, like maybe she moves it almost unnecessarily difficultly and someones calls it out haha.

The feathers are a good detail that I'd like to see carried through. Actually, if Scott and the artists are looking to expand upon these drawings, have a look at Kuchina Dolls. They have a very decorative, native american design to them. She looks good with a sort of dress and tights, very flowing clothing. Maybe a sash or some sort of article of clothing that trails off of her, in a way to accentuate her movements, especially if she were very acrobatic.

But yeah! These are looking pretty sweet so far. Keep it up dudes =]

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L in image 02 is interesting. I don't know the character's personality, but she comes off as a bold flower in this one. The whole series in 02 seems more adventurous and outgoing.

The girls in 01 look haughty. Haughty characters are good for antagonists or sidekicks who get put in their place.

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Looking at these again, I realized something about these drawings: They, for the most part, look like drawings of the same girl, but in different poses and outfits. The outfits aren't even all that different, they're all short dresses.

In a sense I don't really get the point of this thread if you've already decided what the character is going to look like (well, I don't get the point of the whole "which letter do you like" thing, I do get that maybe this thread can serve as constructive criticism).

There's a difference between the upper and lower collection of drawings, though, which maybe is the point, and I am missing it.

I also agree with SurplusGamer's post about our input maybe getting the character to not look interesting enough, but it's kind of moot since there isn't a big enough variety in how the character looks anyway.

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Well there a different points to think about one of the main characters..

First she has to be liked - That will be the "Like'o'Meter" or LOM

Second she has to believabel in her "role" - So its the Role'O'Meter or ROM

Let me explain, i love the sleepy head girl (B) but i wouldnt

believe that she'd make a spritited adventurer like Kiki.. you see?

The last point is, "can you symphatice with her". What is a hero if he/she is an a..hole? Like Prince Charming in Shrek 2. He has everything, the looks, the armour, knows how to fight .. and we hate him..

I will call that the "True Hero Factor" or short, the THF

So lets Start:

Scale 1 - 5 where 1 is lousy and 5 is great

A: LOM:3, ROM:3 THF:2 - She would make a passable villian, nosy, snoby

B: LOM:1, ROM:2 THF:2 - She would have to make a change while the game goes on.. like grown up by hard life, and so on. I wouldnt like to watch a depressed sleepy head all the time

C: LOM:1, ROM:2 THF:2 - Have you seen Naturily Blond? .. yep thats her..

D: LOM:4, ROM:3, THF:3 - Looks like a Princess. She looks like she rather tries to bargaining a problem away then to fight. The problem about her is that you dont think she would make her hands dirty.. and i would expect that from a true hero!

E: LOM:4, ROM:4, THF:5 - You copied Nausicaä here. A true hero. Maybe the dress a bit longer and the hair a bit shorter.

F: LOM:3, ROM:4, THF:3 - That would be an angry "hero", driven by vengeance, close to despair, she would be an interessting charakter! But not a happy one.

G: LOM:1, ROM:1, THF:1 - That pose tells me nothing about the character.

H: LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:1 - Just a girl, has to learn the ways of the wolrd.

I: LOM:2, ROM:3, THF:3 - Potential, but she looks like she takes life on the easy side. Nobody i would fear about.. dont know how to describe it better. Maybe that way: a hero must have the ability to suffer, otherwise it is hard to suffer with him..

J: LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:2 - She looks like a professional dancer.. not a hero

K: LOM:2, ROM:1, THF:1 - Looks like a very thin and serious/angry grandma..

L: LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:2 - Gives me nothing

M: LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:1 - Dito

N: LOM 4, ROM:3, THF:3 - She looks like she has just slain the dragon, rescued the kingdom and is now on vacation...

N: (again?) LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:1 - The eyes catches the whole attention, but they dont tell anything about the character.. beside they are to big..

O: LOM:3, ROM:3, THF:3 - Reminds me of a Disney Movie Princes... guess which one ;). She is ok but not my favorit

P: LOM:4, ROM:5, THF:4 - She has power and fights... i like her

Q: LOM:2, ROM:2, THF:2 - Suspicious .. and boring..

R: LOM:4, ROM:2, THF:2 - Funny.. but no

S: LOM:4, ROM:4, THF:4 - She looks smart, tough and headstrong and self confident.

So my favorit(es) are: S, E, N, F

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Looking at these again, I realized something about these drawings: They, for the most part, look like drawings of the same girl, but in different poses and outfits. The outfits aren't even all that different, they're all short dresses.

In a sense I don't really get the point of this thread if you've already decided what the character is going to look like (well, I don't get the point of the whole "which letter do you like" thing, I do get that maybe this thread can serve as constructive criticism).

There's a difference between the upper and lower collection of drawings, though, which maybe is the point, and I am missing it.

I also agree with SurplusGamer's post about our input maybe getting the character to not look interesting enough, but it's kind of moot since there isn't a big enough variety in how the character looks anyway.

I do have to agree, and don't see enough of a difference amongst these drawings to necessarily compare them, which is why in my post I kind of just said they were all the same and generalized. But, there are some costume varieties that we can talk about, and if anything I just take this post as a blank slate of the character's general feel for all of us to build upon and comment on. Kind of like the very beginning's of a thought and what scott's idea for her is.

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I love P, Q, R and S. R is very funny and the rest are just very fun designs and actually look like a 14-15 year old girl. I know other's say they like cool head N, but I hate that head, and think it is ugly.

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I think of these the one I like the most is P. I like the pixie cut, and the feature, and that flapper dress. Could inform an entire village with a soft art-deco, 1920s inspiration.

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I think of these the one I like the most is P. I like the pixie cut, and the feature, and that flapper dress. Could inform an entire village with a soft art-deco, 1920s inspiration.

Looking at it again, I think I agree with this. The main thing that felt odd to me is the pose. Plus, art-deco is awesome and I support anything that puts it into more games.

I do agree with what people are saying though, with that she should start timid and get confident. The "Spunky, independent princess constricted by her traditions" is pretty much a dead horse that needs no more beating imo. It's a much more satisfying arc if she starts off pretty much just going along with it, and slowly gains the courage to defy her fate.

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Definitely like the diamond head design, so I'm casting my vote for O. I like the design because it shows her character, but at the same time doesn't make the fact that she's a girl her defining characteristic.

She's going to be more then just The Sacrifice Girl, so she needs to be identified by more then just having her gender as the be all and end all of her design. The design of O seems to resonate a bit more with me for that reason, there's definite humour in that little smirk of hers, and you can tell there's something going on behind those eyes of hers.

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I like F. A lot of the others are too "adventurous" in my opinion... If her immediate future entails being fed to a giant monster - I wouldn't think she'd be all "happy go lucky." F has kind of a forlorn/defiant look to it that I like. And O is good too - minus the spiky hair thing... I think some soft wispy things would work better there - than the hard looking spikes...

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It took quite a while to figure out which one I actually liked the most surprisingly I haven't seen anyone choosing it.

It's "C" - first of all I like the pose it reminds me of an Elder Scrolls birthsign. The look on her face gives her a smart and witty maybe even know-it-all slightly arrogant attitude.

I don't know how well it will go with Tim's vision though because when I think Nausicaä I think more of a naive and innocent person, this one looks more cynical than that.

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O for sure. I really like the hairstyle, gives the impression she has thick hair.

I would prefer if the skirt went lower or if her legs were shorter. I am not a fan or long thin legs, looks so "childish".

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N, O, P, and S all look great to me! Hard to decide...

N does indeed have a great head and awesome pose. I would love to see that pose appear in game somewhere :P

O's clothes are cool.

With both N and P I like the contrast of the darker skin and lighter hair.

S... I think I really like the personality that one gives off, if that makes any sense.

All amazing though!

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I love Tim's avatar. It looks awesome.

I like G the best. It looks like she's holding her hat against the wind, fighting against her fate. And I think I just like the way the posture is drawn in this one. Very Tiffany Achingish.

O seems a little too passive for my taste. I like it, but not as much as G.

And I didn't like L or P. I got this Final Fantasy Rikku vibe from it. Which to be honest, I don't like.

I love Miyazki's female protagonists like Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind and Whisper of the Heart because they have this very honest, very real, and almost innocent quality to them. They are put into new and difficult situations and they react the best way they can. These are people I can relate to.

Whereas, games like Lollipop Chainsaw, Dead or Alive, and Final Fantasy X seem to walk this line between being both feminist and exploitative. They show women slaying monsters and beating bad guys, but at the same time, they are doing this in skimpy clothing and short skirts.

R reminds me of Queen Amidala. Her sacrificial regalia perhaps?

To be honest, 2 of my favorite adventure games, Syberia and Longest Journey, had female protagonists, and I really didn't care that much about their clothing or appearance. It was the story and the way that April Ryan and Kate Walker confronted their circumstances that really made me relate to them.

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