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DF Chris Remo

Episode 6: That Bagel Filter Thing

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Great update, as usual.

Really cool to hear the themes of the characters, while not final.

The Cloud area really reminds me of the Village area in Botanicula, and the way you get there is really similar. That crazy Botanicula feel, plus the Bagel art which kinda reminds me of Coraline (for whatever reason) gives me this amazing dream like feel already, even though its nowhere done.

Really glad to see that while the art may have hitches, the puzzles and story, and such are really coming together.

Marius I think was a great choice, even for a brief period. I first heard of him from his Monkey Island parody, and then he did more parodies for the TellTale entry to that series. For him to work on his favorite series, and his personal heroes is really sweet.

Also: I saw a "cloud saves" post-it on the tech wall. This makes me really happy. I'm playing through Deponia right now, and lack of cloud-saves for a game that has 10 puzzles at once in one act is pretty crazy.

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You know, the way Tim talks about the puzzles at around 14 minutes sure does make it sound like the puzzles will only have one solution. That'll be disappointing if that's the case

Surely that would be normal? Usual, for an adventure game, that is. It was never implied they'd be making puzzles with multiple solutions, so I don't know how you could be disappointed.

I'd be interested in an adventure game with lots of different solutions to puzzles, but then again a puzzle with multiple solutions isn't necessarily superior to one without. Each approach has their own advantages and problems,and one of the problems with a multiple-solution approach is, for example...

Well, let me use an analogy. You know the uncanny valley? Where if a face looks almost-but-not-quite real it feels wrong? I think there might be an analogue with puzzle design. In theory the advantage of multiple solutions is that the player gets to feel creative by solving things their own way. But if you build in lots of solutions but don't think of ALL the solutions that should be good, people feel cheated whenever they have a good idea that the game doesn't support. But if you design the puzzle such that only one puzzle will work, they're much more likely to just shrug it off and say 'oh, well, obviously that wasn't it.' I loved Stacking, but I think it had this problem a few times.

Other problems would be that that would take a lot longer to hook up and test, meaning there'd have to be a lot fewer puzzles over all. There are other issues with the idea, too, which I think mean that it'd fall outside the scope of the project, really.

But single-solution puzzles are great too! For all the reasons that Tim alluded to: you get to really craft the puzzle solving experience in a way that you can't really do if you want to give your puzzles multiple solutions. It's difficult to design, say, 3 ways of solving one thing that are -equally- crafty: take Stacking again for example: there were multiple solutions but usually one particular method was much more obvious, and if you were playing the game just to get from one puzzle to the next, and get through the story (which is much more likely to be the case in a plot heavy game like this) then I think a lot of people would miss some of the cleverer puzzles. That'd make it replayable to discover them, but it might weaken the experience of their first playthrough. With single-solution puzzles, Tim has an easier time making sure all the puzzles are creative and follow that curve that he describes in this episode.

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By the way, is DoubleFine sponsored by the guys who made Limbo? I think I've seen Limbo posters and t-shirts in just about every episode :)

They visited the office one time and left a whole bunch of t-shirts! It's rare that a day goes by without at least one person wearing a Limbo shirt.

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I also love the increase of profanities in this episode :)

Chris, would it be possible to add more subtitles to the episodes? There are backers who are not English speaking and sometimes we might miss something because of the volume or some noise. I know this makes it harder, I imagine there will be a lot of extra work.

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Fantastic episode. We're really getting into the dirt now.

I am sure this is just acting. In real, they are doing great and they have already finished the game. Look at all this art-work done - this looks spectacular (and still some of the best scenes are blacked-out in the movies).

They are nowhere near finished with the game. Just because there is art done doesn't mean the game has been coded or tested or that art is even in the game yet.

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Where did Tim get that sweet Rubik's cube made of colored plastic instead of black with stickers? I want one.

For that matter, how many twisty Rubik's-y puzzled does Tim HAVE? There's there's that one shot where he's got like seven piled up on his desk.

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Where did Tim get that sweet Rubik's cube made of colored plastic instead of black with stickers? I want one.

For that matter, how many twisty Rubik's-y puzzled does Tim HAVE? There's there's that one shot where he's got like seven piled up on his desk.

From a cuber (who has some of the stuff on Tims desk, but not all), the curved white plastic 3x3x3 is from V-Cube

http://www.v-cubes.com/index.php

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Every episode I watch just makes the anticipation that much worse!

Now, to hunt down where Bagel's awesome hoodie came from...

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You know, I think I appreciated this episode more than I liked it. Previous episodes have been more about the active making of a game, something of short films, and the last episode had some great tension due to the roadblocks they were all hitting, whereas this episode was more a progress report of much smaller hurdles and to show that the game is going along. In that regard, this felt much less cinematic than the last episodes, but by having less chaos I appreciated the kind of non-business talk we got to see, from the "Developers F*** us in the a$$" comment to all of the actual gameplay/sneaks we finally get to see. Good on ya.

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Freaking awesome episode!

It gave a feel for how it is to actually make art for a game!

About the visual style, I am really happy that Bagel took that confrontation, it is going to make or break the game. And that you are taking it into account shows real integrity for me.

So yeah Bagel, go for it! I believe what you make will be better to produce in the timeframe available aswell.

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Another great episode! And unlike some I have no problem with the swearing - if that is how you talk, then that is how you talk. This doesn't need to be edited for tv or some such, so no need to either bleep out stuff or try to force people to speak in a different maner. Especially bleeping out swearwords would be a creative defeat from my point of view.

Oh and regarding Amnesia Fortnight - keep it to yourself, guys! Don't spoil any of your upcoming game ideas, keep it hidden until you can surprise us with actual upcoming games where the concept is locked down. In reality I would /love/ to see how it plays out, but at the same time I know it would spoil the eventual reveal and excitement regarding the games that spawn from this.

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Another great episode, guys! I feel like I'm learning more about the process each month. I thought last month's was going to be the start of a really tough time, but as it turned out, it was fine! Tim was right all along. This new hurdle regarding Bagel's style seems like a non-problem, too, as everyone wants the same solution. Hurrah!

What an awesome series of documentaries this is! And what an emotional roller coaster, too. So glad I backed this.

You know, I think I'm actually going to be sad when the game is finished.

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Can't view this:

Vimeo displays the following msg:

"Sorry The creator of this video has not given you permission to embed it on this domain. This is a Vimeo Plus feature."

Same on Kickstarter

edit: nevermind, works in chrome, but not in FF

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2 Player Productions have done an amazing job! Congratulations!

Also the Programmers are AWESOME!

Even from the few minutes of demonstration you can see that both engine and Scene Editor are amazing.

3340u8p.jpg

Besides the scene editor, i would die for some details on the actual pathfinding algorithm! It is hard to find good implementations on the web.

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I really loved this episode, especially everything that had to do with Bagel's role in the adventure game.

I hope we can see his surreal style in the finished product.

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This episode completely encapsulates what's so great about this project's open documentary style. Not only are we seeing some amazing progress on the game (far more than you'd ever see on any publisher-lead game at this point of development), but we're also getting a really unique insight into the problems. For instance, when Tim first pitched the idea of basing the game on Bagel's art, I never for a moment thought of the complications that could arise from that.

Learning this sort of thing makes me really glad I backed. And on top of it all the visuals we've seen and concept music is absolutely beautiful.

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I'm not sure if it's what you were going for, but I like some of the "spoil it for yourself, if you want to" moments in the video - where sitckyboards were in focus just long enough to pause and read if you were interested enough, but not so much that you'd accidentally spoil something for yourself if you were trying to avoid it.

It seemed like Bagel had wanted to say something about the game being "Bagel style", and I found it interesting that this was something Tim had mentioned in previous videos (though I suspect this was showcased with deliberate editing). The narrative I get is that Tim was concerned about the art not having Bagel's conceptual influence, but hadn't really communicated it?

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The game is looking really great. I sure hope Bagel is able to start doing some concept art. Otherwise he's just going to phone it in, no fun working on something that you don't feel is true to your original vision/idea.

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