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The Idea Guy

[Suggestion] More Resources

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Are you tired of simply mining asteroids for raw matter? Would you like things to be more complicated? Do you think Space Chickens are friggin awesome?

If you answered yes to any of those questions, I've got a suggestion you'll love!

More Resources:

-Add resources: Water, Fuel and Crystal.

+Water will appear as chunks of ice embedded in asteroids.

+Fuel will appear as sleightly glowing portions of asteroids.

+Crystal will look... Crystally? and SHINY!

-Water will be a necessary resource that your citizens need in order to survive.

-Fuel will be used for reactors/generators.

-Crystal will be used for trade possibly, or some high tiered machines.

-Add machines:

+Water Purifier, converts chunks of space ice into liquid water.

+Matter Converter, changes Matter <-> Water, and Matter <-> Fuel, this is not cheap to do, and

some will be lost to waste each time.

+Water Recycler, Bear Grylls did it, why not you? Once built, no more water will be lost when used (expensive, high-tiered

machine).

-Add Objects:

+Water Tank, stores water

+Fuel Rod Container, stores refined fuel.

+Matter Tank, stores raw matter

Tell me what you think!

Cheers.

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I just think that crystal just wouldn't fit well in the space...I guess just using matter as a currency is good. But the other suggestions, yes!

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Crystal doesn't jibe well with me. But something solid, surely: Minerals giving you metals, and rocks, providing you bulk matter and concrete.

As for fuel, there's something to think about. Are we using nuclear fusion(usually simplified as hydrogen fused to helium), nuclear fission(well, normal nuclear power plants of today), solar rays, chemical reactions (burning fuels, consuming oxygen), some magical fictional new fuel whose mechanisms are glossed over. How do we deal with waste? These are all very different from each other.

Water is good, because it provides both oxygen for breathing and hydrogen for nuclear fusion, if that's our choice. We need an energy source to split them though...

Honestly, I see this game needing much more polish in the form of social simulations before resource management of this kind becomes an item for the development agenda.

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I think the matter refinery sounds like it could create whatever it pleases (because it's future). But it'd be really cool if they took it away and used your idea. Or the matter refinery just can't make certain things. I imagine space chickens will be a major resource that can only be found in walls or something.

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Crystal doesn't jibe well with me. But something solid, surely: Minerals giving you metals, and rocks, providing you bulk matter and concrete.

As for fuel, there's something to think about. Are we using nuclear fusion(usually simplified as hydrogen fused to helium), nuclear fission(well, normal nuclear power plants of today), solar rays, chemical reactions (burning fuels, consuming oxygen), some magical fictional new fuel whose mechanisms are glossed over. How do we deal with waste? These are all very different from each other.

Water is good, because it provides both oxygen for breathing and hydrogen for nuclear fusion, if that's our choice. We need an energy source to split them though...

Honestly, I see this game needing much more polish in the form of social simulations before resource management of this kind becomes an item for the development agenda.

Yeah, I didn't really like the sound of "Crystal" when i was first jotting this idea down, it was really just a placeholder for a rare and valuable resource. Also, I intend to adress the matter of fuel in an upcoming post, a very long one with a lot of ideas about power and related items. Thanks for the input!

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I think the matter refinery sounds like it could create whatever it pleases (because it's future). But it'd be really cool if they took it away and used your idea. Or the matter refinery just can't make certain things. I imagine space chickens will be a major resource that can only be found in walls or something.

The Matter converter shouldn't be able to just make anything, it would be for conversions between matter, water, and fuel. Also, it's not lossless, meaning that if you convert 100 matter into 75 fuel, 75 fuel will not convert to 100 matter, there are resources lost in the process.

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Presumably they have the technology to turn any matter into any other type of matter, but you could still have different resource types.

-The conversion process presumably takes a lot of energy so useful ores and such could still be worth more than non-useful ores.

-You could have resources that provide other perks, say additional science.

-There could be some sort of made up impossibrium element needed by high-end machines and technology which your replicators can't reproduce.

etc.

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obviously the game needs tweaking and balancing, but those resources you listed would eventually run out, you could scavenge crystal by destroying machines that used it, but water and fuel would be in short supply, so maybe they should be replicable ( ie. star trek replicator) but like in star trek they can't replicate dilithium crystals so they would be rare

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obviously the game needs tweaking and balancing, but those resources you listed would eventually run out, you could scavenge crystal by destroying machines that used it, but water and fuel would be in short supply, so maybe they should be replicable ( ie. star trek replicator) but like in star trek they can't replicate dilithium crystals so they would be rare

Hence the water recycler, all water based liquid waste is 100% cleaned and recycled into pure water.

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Crystal doesn't strike a chord with me, either... I like the idea of scavenging it, that's pretty rad!

Maybe something more spacey, like... Uh... Spacidium! Genius!

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We'll I like the idea of more stuff, matter isn't everything, but maybe, the floating chunks around your base should be made up of different particles as discussed earlier, but we also need timed events, like asteroids which pop in for a few minutes and then disappear. This away you can get more resources over time and we would need to alter their behavior a bit, since we don't want them moving, like they show up, and we assume they are moving and will leave after 10 minutes, if a miner is still in its influence when it leaves, guess what they are going on a space journey. But having different resources, a way to trade with others and loot from asteroids would be great. Also for loot we need a secure storage room for raiders to target.

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I think diversification is good, eventually, but for now, I would put it somewhat low on the list, because I think the matter system works fairly well. Heck, they had replicators in Star Trek, so once Spacebase implements gardens, they will already be more realistic.

Also, the idea that people living in deep space could 'mine' enough water to survive is actually less believable than synthesizing their own water.

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A place to store matter seems like a good idea, but a separate object seems unnecessary. Maybe the matter converters could simply have a storage limit, requiring you to build more if you want a higher capacity. But in that case, it would also make sense to require builders to pick up matter from storage before construction, which seems like a pain.

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Instead of different resource blocks, another possibility would be to divide up matter into percentages of different elements, like hydrogen, oxygen, carbon, etc. So mining a single block would proportionally increase your stores of whatever elements happened to be in it, and then different elements would be required depending on what you were trying to build. Conceptually complicated, but in terms of gameplay, I think it would still be fairly simple.

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I Definitely Think having matter/energy as the only resources is a bad idea.

There needs to be lots of stuff, and lots of things needed to make that stuff.

In a combat focused game like Total annihilation, it works to streamline the economy and focus on the combat.

However in a building / gathering game the fun comes from the convoluted resource collecting and refining.

Constantly working to build more X to increase the production of Y to eventually Create more Z.

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Instead of different resource blocks, another possibility would be to divide up matter into percentages of different elements, like hydrogen, oxygen, carbon, etc. So mining a single block would proportionally increase your stores of whatever elements happened to be in it, and then different elements would be required depending on what you were trying to build. Conceptually complicated, but in terms of gameplay, I think it would still be fairly simple.

The only problem with this is needing a specific element and possibly getting unlucky and never finding it.

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Instead of different resource blocks, another possibility would be to divide up matter into percentages of different elements, like hydrogen, oxygen, carbon, etc. So mining a single block would proportionally increase your stores of whatever elements happened to be in it, and then different elements would be required depending on what you were trying to build. Conceptually complicated, but in terms of gameplay, I think it would still be fairly simple.

The only problem with this is needing a specific element and possibly getting unlucky and never finding it.

We'll, maybe you need to hit up the space market and trade some matter for x at a fluctuating and simulated price. But that may involve more doing, but instead of destroying asteroid chunks I would love to build a mine entrance, to kinda say it's bigger than we thought, and would help once they figure out the 3D part, since if the base can be multi-level, surly asteroids can be too. We really need space vehicles so we can mine outside our base and extend our resource chain.

I would love to encrust my base in an asteroid, so microasteroids won't hit me, but every time I mine I chance opening up a deadly breach.

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thinking about it a bit more, i reckon more resources to balance and acquire would be good, just as long as there are renewable ways to get resources, like maybe fuel could be space dust and you would need to build space dust collectors that convert it into fuel, or crystals could be grown out of some resource you can consistently collect (possibly a specific plant that gets processed ), there could be many different types of resources, just as long as there was some way to get more of it and make an economy out of it

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thinking about it a bit more, i reckon more resources to balance and acquire would be good, just as long as there are renewable ways to get resources, like maybe fuel could be space dust and you would need to build space dust collectors that convert it into fuel, or crystals could be grown out of some resource you can consistently collect (possibly a specific plant that gets processed ), there could be many different types of resources, just as long as there was some way to get more of it and make an economy out of it

The problem with changing the current system is, what exactly are you building with if it's not just general matter? Space dust and crystals are still matter, so why could I not just use them as building material? And if I can use 'Matter' to build a wall or a computer, or whatever other contraptions are in the game, why can't I just use it to synthesize fuel?

Most games of this type use a currency for construction, but that doesn't make sense in this case. So if you want the game to differentiate between different forms of matter, there need to be enough specific types to cover whatever building materials might be used, not to mention a corresponding change in the fiction their using to explain these systems.

Personally, I'd like to see this complexity go into other places first. I'm not saying I would dislike using a variety of resources, but it seems like a pretty massive change from their current direction.

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thinking about it a bit more, i reckon more resources to balance and acquire would be good, just as long as there are renewable ways to get resources, like maybe fuel could be space dust and you would need to build space dust collectors that convert it into fuel, or crystals could be grown out of some resource you can consistently collect (possibly a specific plant that gets processed ), there could be many different types of resources, just as long as there was some way to get more of it and make an economy out of it

The problem with changing the current system is, what exactly are you building with if it's not just general matter? Space dust and crystals are still matter, so why could I not just use them as building material? And if I can use 'Matter' to build a wall or a computer, or whatever other contraptions are in the game, why can't I just use it to synthesize fuel?

Most games of this type use a currency for construction, but that doesn't make sense in this case. So if you want the game to differentiate between different forms of matter, there need to be enough specific types to cover whatever building materials might be used, not to mention a corresponding change in the fiction their using to explain these systems.

Personally, I'd like to see this complexity go into other places first. I'm not saying I would dislike using a variety of resources, but it seems like a pretty massive change from their current direction.

more resources mean more variety and more things to do, like plants, if everything is made out of "matter" why do you need plants if you can just materialise food? for variety thats why, you could just have it so you can make anything out of mining one resource, but that is a bit boring, and it gives you less reasons to expand, but with multiple resources and different types of industry it gets more complex and interesting to manage and play

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thinking about it a bit more, i reckon more resources to balance and acquire would be good, just as long as there are renewable ways to get resources, like maybe fuel could be space dust and you would need to build space dust collectors that convert it into fuel, or crystals could be grown out of some resource you can consistently collect (possibly a specific plant that gets processed ), there could be many different types of resources, just as long as there was some way to get more of it and make an economy out of it

The problem with changing the current system is, what exactly are you building with if it's not just general matter? Space dust and crystals are still matter, so why could I not just use them as building material? And if I can use 'Matter' to build a wall or a computer, or whatever other contraptions are in the game, why can't I just use it to synthesize fuel?

Most games of this type use a currency for construction, but that doesn't make sense in this case. So if you want the game to differentiate between different forms of matter, there need to be enough specific types to cover whatever building materials might be used, not to mention a corresponding change in the fiction their using to explain these systems.

Personally, I'd like to see this complexity go into other places first. I'm not saying I would dislike using a variety of resources, but it seems like a pretty massive change from their current direction.

The problem is being interesting, having general "Matter" is really simple, and just doesn't seem to fit a game that's about managing a complex system. There should be a balance between the simplicity of just Matter and actually a full periodic table of elements to gather.

That's why I suggested the conversion machine, Fuel sources and the rare minerals (be it crystal or shiny space rocks) should be quite dense. They would take a lot of matter to convert (something as high as 100 to 1), meaning that it is highly inefficient to just convert them from raw matter but you can if you need to in a pinch.

The issue of renewability could be solved with a number of different things, for example, a plant that actually grows fuel (or crystal). Or a lossless infinite chain reaction Reactor, or the water recycler, or more asteroids drifting into your sector. That's really what resource management is about, making sure you have enough to sustain you in the case that you run out for a while, and eventually attaining a lossless system that doesn't need any more [insert material here].

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